Wallace
Joined: May 26, 2004
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 Posted:
Feb 02, 2006 - 04:24 |
 
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In the SWL (the longest running and bestest league on FUMBBL) a Rock, Scissors, Paper, Dynamite system is used. Dynamite is all the races that are crap (Ogre, Vampire and the two stunties), the other kind of speak for themselves. The roster is found here http://www.snorriheim.com/swl/roster/roster.php
Not saying it's the only way to go but it works well and keeps the league pretty balanced.
edit: missed page 2 of the discussion, I see the SWL system has already been mentioned. Oh well, at least I provided a link  |
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Ballcrusher
Joined: Dec 25, 2003
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Dec 23, 2010 - 17:18 |
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Hi all
I just saw this old thread, and I was wondering if anyone has ideas or experience with catagorizing races when using LRB6 rules? F.ex. how are the three new races? Any race who change significally in LRB6, f.ex is khemri and ogre still bashy or more crazy fun like vampire and gobbos?
Our league is restarting due to the new client, and I just want to make sure our league is still a bit balanced, so the bashy or agile teams won't outnumber the others... |
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RC
Joined: Sep 22, 2005
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Dec 23, 2010 - 17:30 |
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Norse are definetly bashy now. Chaos pact are bashy. Underworld are agile or balanced. Ogre are crap. Khemri are.. balanced. Vamps are better so.. balanced or agile. Necro might have moved into the bashy column since everyone seems to be able to roll MB on their wolfs and are kickng the crap out of orcs and dwarfs. Undead might be bashy or balanced but I don't think they are bashy enough to be real bashers 
Flings are flings, gobbos are gobbos and lizzards.. well they pick a lot so I don't know. You can build them very bashy but mostly I think they are balanced. Slann are weird but goes into balanced.
Nurgle are superbashy from being kinda.. meh bashy in lrb4. |
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RedDevilCG
Joined: Jan 09, 2010
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Dec 25, 2010 - 21:40 |
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Underworld is a very fragile team, and require a lot of experience and finesse. They start off very weak, but get much better with mutations in the medium TV range (TV1300+). If you like a challenge, and don't feel rage at losing games and players, I recommend them. I don't know what classification scheme you are using but I would say they are:
Challenging, running game over passing game, fragile, agile, and have niche players. |
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Mr_Foulscumm
Joined: Mar 05, 2005
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Dec 25, 2010 - 23:13 |
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Update Khemri from Bashy to Useless please
And add Ogres to that category too |
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MrNomad
Joined: Mar 24, 2007
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Dec 26, 2010 - 00:26 |
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I would not call undead bashy under any circumstances. 2 players with S access? Only 4 other players have A access those have no regen and low av. I have always called undead a finesse team. Because they sure as heck are not agile, bashy, or balanced. |
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fly
Joined: Aug 02, 2003
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Dec 26, 2010 - 00:59 |
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i've always called undead a fouling team, and they can keep that description if you ask me... |
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LordSnotball
Joined: Nov 05, 2004
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Dec 26, 2010 - 01:41 |
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uuni
Joined: Mar 12, 2010
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Dec 26, 2010 - 13:35 |
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Thank you for starting a quite interesting topic.
In the last June, I made a small graph about the orientation of different races in LRB6, a version of which is in the image:
Race's bashiness grows to right and ballyness grows to up.
Depending on the variables introduced, the relative placement of a race can move quite much, and I think that the chart is best as when taken as a base for one's opinion. I still have a feeling, that the random movement places the races quite close to the points they occupy in this chart.
According to this chart, your proposed division would go roughly as follows:
Stunty / Tier 3:
Halfling, Goblin, Ogre, Underworld(border), Vampire (border), Khemri (border).
Agile:
Wood Elf, Elf, High Elf, Slann, Skaven, Dark Elv, Human, Amazon (border), Lixardmen (border).
Bash:
Dwarf, Chaos Dwarf, Nurgle, Orc, Chaos, Necromantic, Undead, Chaos Pact (border), Norse (border).
Balanced:
Norse, Amazon, Chaos Pact, Lizardmen, Human (border), Undead (border), Chaos (border), Vampires (border), Orc (border).
The chart was made out of the rulebooks description of race-rosters. A rating for each position's bashiness and ballyness was determined by counting its stats, startup skills and skill category accesses multiplied with preselected multipliers. Then two 11 player rosters were selected for each race, a roster with the players that totalled the maximum bashiness points and vice versa a similar roster for maximum balliness points. Race's bashiness and balliness values were set to the respective values of these rosters. Rosters were read from the CRP and the extra team NAF rulesheet.
This chart contains errors, misreadings and incorrect valuation. The relative position of races can vary somewhat, if different valuations for skills, stats or skill accesses are introduced. For example, the the position of the Vampires depends heavily of the valuation of Bloodlust and Hypnotic Gaze -skills. Other heavily influencing factors are the valuation of strength and agility, valuation of Block, Dodge and Mighty Blow skills and the valuation of skill accesses.
***
This chart agrees with the widely held belief that Wood Elves are the roster most able to play ball, Dwarves are the roster most able to bash and Halfings are the roster with fevest abilities.
It is interesting to note, that the Slann and the Chaos Dwarves seem to come a little ahead of the line of other "good" teams (not counting Wood Elves and Dwarves). I have heard some arguments that these two teams are somewhat imbalanced and too good.
The position of Necromantic roster raises an eyebrow. It is supposed to have come to the top tier with the newest modification, but this is not reflected in this chart.
An interesting point is also that the Humans are actually not a typical team but instead quite ball playing one. Perhaps when inventing new team rosters, weight should be given to introducing new good ball players instead of new good bashers? |
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RC
Joined: Sep 22, 2005
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| Posted:
Dec 26, 2010 - 14:46 |
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| MrNomad wrote: | | I would not call undead bashy under any circumstances. 2 players with S access? Only 4 other players have A access those have no regen and low av. I have always called undead a finesse team. Because they sure as heck are not agile, bashy, or balanced. |
4 players now with st access. |
_________________
"Oh, you hate your job? Why didn't you say so? There's a support group for that. It's called EVERYBODY, and they meet at the bar." |
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Wreckage
Joined: Aug 15, 2004
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Dec 26, 2010 - 14:52 |
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hmm, what I never liked about the term bashiness is that it is unspecific wether it is about the ability to take hits or the ability to deal hits...
both types require very different play types....
good damage dealers are imo Norse and Chaos...
Good hittakers are dwarves and orcs.
Dwarves are also decent damagedealers but with the orcs the hittaking really is more in the centre of their abilities.
There are reasons to believe that teams with mutation access+necros will be the only really good damage dealing teams in the future tho... ie the ones that can take on the strongest kind of teams the hittaking teams and wrap them up like paper. |
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Mr_Foulscumm
Joined: Mar 05, 2005
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Dec 26, 2010 - 15:48 |
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| Wreckage wrote: | | take on the strongest kind of teams the hittaking teams and wrap them up like paper. |
Why would wrap up paper? Funny Christmas gift for someone that has just bought a printer? |
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MrNomad
Joined: Mar 24, 2007
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| Posted:
Dec 26, 2010 - 15:48 |
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| RC wrote: | | MrNomad wrote: | | I would not call undead bashy under any circumstances. 2 players with S access? Only 4 other players have A access those have no regen and low av. I have always called undead a finesse team. Because they sure as heck are not agile, bashy, or balanced. |
4 players now with st access. |
I was guessing we were going by current rules since FFB is not implemented yet and the OP did not specify FFB that I could tell. If he did then also mummies lost G access which will slow them down somewhat requiring doubles to get useful skills. |
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Mr_Foulscumm
Joined: Mar 05, 2005
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| Posted:
Dec 26, 2010 - 15:50 |
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| MrNomad wrote: | | RC wrote: | | MrNomad wrote: | | I would not call undead bashy under any circumstances. 2 players with S access? Only 4 other players have A access those have no regen and low av. I have always called undead a finesse team. Because they sure as heck are not agile, bashy, or balanced. |
4 players now with st access. |
I was guessing we were going by current rules since FFB is not implemented yet and the OP did not specify FFB that I could tell. If he did then also mummies lost G access which will slow them down somewhat requiring doubles to get useful skills. |
It does seem fairly redundant to do this for LRB4. |
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RedDevilCG
Joined: Jan 09, 2010
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| Posted:
Dec 26, 2010 - 18:53 |
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