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garyt1



Joined: Mar 12, 2011

Post   Posted: Feb 22, 2018 - 00:39 Reply with quote Back to top

Some folks use zero rerolls, other than leader, and perhaps no reserves. So their team value is all there on the pitch with out any possible bloat. But I don't think this is an enjoyable way for most people to play. They aim to dominate opponents with the hope that they bash well and don't get outnumbered, while not doing many risky plays. But then they are exposing themselves to the effects of getting a couple of bad turns of rolls (even one crucial bad roll) and problems if your opponent takes out a couple of your team.

In a game heavily influenced by chance it doesn't make sense not to allow yourself at least a couple of opportunities to reroll per half. Double skulls at the start of turn 1. Oh good..

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DarthPhysicist



Joined: Jun 14, 2015

Post   Posted: Feb 22, 2018 - 00:44 Reply with quote Back to top

It's silliness. So let me give you a scenario. You do this with wood elves typically but if you lose a catcher, what are you now prioritizing? Adding a reroll or adding a catcher? The reroll now costs twice as much and if the original plan has any merit, you are replacing the catcher before the reroll. But no, people quickly realize that they need those rerolls. The reasoning often goes "but I can start leveling my positionals much faster!" but on teams like wood elves, you can pretty much level the first catcher, buy the next one, level it, buy the next one, and that's if you haven't decided to level the wardancers already. It's better to just buy the rerolls up front at normal price and then add positionals as funds dictate than try to be "cute".

When I see players do this, I foul the crap out of their expensive players; winning the game be damned. I want them to live in the house they built for themselves.

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Keothi



Joined: Jul 08, 2013

Post   Posted: Feb 22, 2018 - 00:54 Reply with quote Back to top

I always advise to play with team RR; I think a developed side can play with 2 or 3 RR very comfortably and end the half with 1 or 2 banked/unspent when things are in your favour. But if the game swings the other way and you're down 9 vs 11; you are probably going to be facing a few unfavourable options to maximise the use of your players. It might mean dodging away on a 3+ to lend an assist for a critical 2DB hit, or maybe risking a 1DB hit to open up a gap to then direct your Blitz where you need it to happen. It's when you're there that you want the RR; or when you blitz their baller and you roll double PUSHBACK but a POW or Defender Stumbles will spill the ball. Convert a 55% chance up to 80% with a team RR; that's easily worth 50k in my opinion and when else can you so drastically influence the result of a game for a paltry 50k?
ArrestedDevelopment



Joined: Sep 14, 2015

Post   Posted: Feb 22, 2018 - 01:33 Reply with quote Back to top

I don't know, I don't play many races with 50k rerolls??

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Buu88



Joined: Mar 11, 2012

Post   Posted: Feb 22, 2018 - 04:59 Reply with quote Back to top

You have 1 in 6 chance of failing...No matter who you are. There is way too many things to do with those horrible of odds.
pythrr



Joined: Mar 07, 2006

Post   Posted: Feb 22, 2018 - 06:41 Reply with quote Back to top

Buu88 wrote:
You have 1 in 6 chance of failing...No matter who you are. There is way too many things to do with those horrible of odds.


unless u are dorfs. then _most_ of the time you have a 1/36 chance of failing. and then a 1/9 with yr runner got get the ball.

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bghandras



Joined: Feb 06, 2011

Post   Posted: Feb 22, 2018 - 11:43 Reply with quote Back to top

The 1st team reroll is usually very good, and worth more than any. The value of extra reroll decreases the more you have them. So 2nd is not worth as much as the 1st, and the 3rd is not much as the 2nd, and so on.
Considering the risk and the reward, i would risk the statement of 1 reroll being generally better than 0 reroll. I cant remember rolling with less than 2 rerolls, be it with 2 team rerolls, or 1 team reroll and 1 leader. But i prefer 3 team rerolls most of the time.

If you want to be extremely TW efficient with your theory, then you consider the cost of the team reroll, and go for a lower number with a roster with expensive reroll, and go little higher with races with cheap reroll. Same about the leader, and about its access.

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ThierryM



Joined: Mar 27, 2015

Post   Posted: Feb 22, 2018 - 13:53 Reply with quote Back to top

Who needs RRs when you have Bones !! https://fumbbl.com/p/team?team_id=810578

Join the NRA (No Rerolls Association ! not the US bangbangers...).

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lawofthewest



Joined: Nov 09, 2017

Post   Posted: Feb 22, 2018 - 16:15 Reply with quote Back to top

pythrr wrote:
Buu88 wrote:
You have 1 in 6 chance of failing...No matter who you are. There is way too many things to do with those horrible of odds.


unless u are dorfs. then _most_ of the time you have a 1/36 chance of failing. and then a 1/9 with yr runner got get the ball.


yes, the dwarves don't suffer that much like others having 0 rerolls. That was also the race I managed to lead for a 0 reroll win Smile
MattDakka



Joined: Oct 09, 2007

Post   Posted: Feb 22, 2018 - 16:24 Reply with quote Back to top

Dwarfs have great blocking reliability but they still need rrs for GFIs and the odd 1d actions like dodges and passes, also, even if you spend the game 2d blocking, double skulls may happen.
I would never play them with less than 3 rrs.

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ThierryM



Joined: Mar 27, 2015

Post   Posted: Feb 22, 2018 - 17:25 Reply with quote Back to top

Races with built in skills like Block / pass / dodge don't need RRs that much.
Play it safe.
And the less RRs you have, the more you focus on your game, learning to prioritize your actions in the process )
It worked (a bit) like that for me.

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MattDakka



Joined: Oct 09, 2007

Post   Posted: Feb 22, 2018 - 17:38 Reply with quote Back to top

Even when playing safely you can't avoid to roll double skulls, nor you can't avoid the casualties, especially when you are playing at high TV where Clawmb is more common (and Tackle if you are playing a team with many Dodge skills).
At that point playing safely might be harder and some risky 1d actions might be required.

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gpope



Joined: Jun 04, 2010

Post   Posted: Feb 22, 2018 - 18:14 Reply with quote Back to top

Yeah, a full field of dwarves can manage well enough without rerolls and probably weather the occasional turnover with careful positioning. That's what dwarves are all about, after all. But once you start losing dwarves you need to start leaning on d6s and 1dbs and then you're pretty well hosed if you don't have a reroll or two socked away.
lawofthewest



Joined: Nov 09, 2017

Post   Posted: Mar 17, 2018 - 12:09 Reply with quote Back to top

0 rerolls game:

https://fumbbl.com/p/match?id=3973779

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jori3641



Joined: Jan 17, 2015

Post   Posted: Mar 17, 2018 - 12:35 Reply with quote Back to top

I play without rerolls in some of my teams. Primarily beacuse:

1. I dont like to keep track of a gazillion opposition skills. If I play without rerolls box or ranked I can keep my TV low while stil having a bunch of skills myself. This is not minmaxing in the common meaning of the word. I dont do it because I think it the way to win games. I do it because I have more fun that way.

2. One of the worst things in blood bowl is to use a reroll and still cause a turnover. If I play without rerolls I dont have to worry about that Smile
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