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JellyBelly



Joined: Jul 08, 2009

Post 9 Posted: Sep 13, 2009 - 19:27 Reply with quote Back to top

Hey everyone. I started playing on FUMBBL about three months ago and I've played about 65-70 games so far. At first I was holding my own fairly well at around CR150, but in my last 15 or so ranked games I've been doing terribly and my CR has been plummeting. Check out my CR progression here:

My CR over time

I can't remember the last time I won a ranked match. I was wondering if any of the more experienced coaches out there might be able to give me some pointers as to where I'm going wrong?

I can already see the approaching tide of responses telling me that I'm crap (most likely true), but I feel that there must be something I'm doing wrong. I don't think I've been playing that badly - I've had quite a few close matches recently, but they just don't seem to be going my way for one reason or another. Maybe it's because now my teams are rising above the rookie level to TR150-160 and there are just more good coaches in that range? Or, maybe there's something not quite right with my team development, relating to managing TR or dealing with injuries?

If anyone's got a spare couple of minutes, I'd be very grateful if they could have a look at some of my ranked teams to see if there's something I'm doing wrong.

I guess CR144 isn't as bad as it could be ...

P.S. for some reason the HTML doesn't seem to be working in the post. I don't suppose anyone could help me out with that too, could they? I am such an HTML retard .... [edited: this has now been fixed Very Happy]

Ohhh ...... now I'm going to get flamed ....... Sad


Last edited by JellyBelly on Sep 13, 2009 - 22:33; edited 1 time in total
Sigmar1



Joined: Aug 13, 2008

Post   Posted: Sep 13, 2009 - 19:55 Reply with quote Back to top

A quick glance at some of your higher TR teams seems to reveal that you carry nearly full rosters. So, if you're playing 150 TR with 15 players vs. a 150 TR team with 12 players...your opponents players are going to be quite a bit better than yours, and his starting 11 is likely to severely outclass your starters.

Not definative but may be a contributor to your difficulties at higher TR. Of course, you only need to take a couple players out before your numbers come into play so you always want some subs, but a nearly full roster is pretty much always weaker than a smaller roster of the same rating.
Mr_Foulscumm



Joined: Mar 05, 2005

Post   Posted: Sep 13, 2009 - 20:06 Reply with quote Back to top

CR is for suckers

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nin



Joined: May 27, 2005

Post   Posted: Sep 13, 2009 - 20:37 Reply with quote Back to top

After a quick look I think I see some problems of development (but take this carefully, I'm not that sharp)

Undead: too many players for an Undead team without DP

Lizardmen: bit overgrown Skinks compared to Saurus... too many perm. injuries

High Elves: in need of more RR's coupled with 11 not very healthy players and low FF. Of all your teams, probably the hardest to recover.

Orcs: too long roster for av9 at that TR means that your BOBs and Blitzers are underdeveloped. Fire things (couple of unskilled linos, Catch gobbo, -ma Thrower) and buy a Troll asap
G_Force



Joined: Aug 19, 2004

Post   Posted: Sep 13, 2009 - 20:54 Reply with quote Back to top

technically there is nothing wrong with your HTML there

<a href="http://www.fumbbl.com/FUMBBL.php?page=coach&op=development&coach=103972">My CR over time</a>

that would work in a team, player or coach bio sheet.

BUT

the forum doesn't fully support standard HTML and you need BBCode (buletin board code i think)

like this:
Code:

[url=http://www.fumbbl.com/FUMBBL.php?page=coach&op=development&coach=103972]My CR over time[/url]


gives you
My CR over time

TADA!!!

If you preview your forum posts you get some extra buttons that contain the BBCode tags which is helpful while you get used to things.

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pythrr



Joined: Mar 07, 2006

Post   Posted: Sep 13, 2009 - 20:57 Reply with quote Back to top

ok, my two cents.

when one begins on fummbl, you have mainly low TR teams, and therefore play a mix of [1] n00bs and [2] decent coaches starting new teams.

then, later, you have mid to high TR teams, and you play mainly establisehd coaches.

Moreover - low TR vs low TR = more reliant upon dice and luck, so newish players can hold their won on average regardless of skill (unless they are really bad, like chewie)

Later, at higher TR, skill choices and clever ways of using / deploying skills come into play, which gives the advantage to better coaches.

them's my thoughts.

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Igvy



Joined: Apr 29, 2007

Post   Posted: Sep 13, 2009 - 21:02 Reply with quote Back to top

nin wrote:
After a quick look I think I see some problems of development (but take this carefully, I'm not that sharp)

Undead: too many players for an Undead team without DP

Lizardmen: bit overgrown Skinks compared to Saurus... too many perm. injuries

High Elves: in need of more RR's coupled with 11 not very healthy players and low FF. Of all your teams, probably the hardest to recover.

Orcs: too long roster for av9 at that TR means that your BOBs and Blitzers are underdeveloped. Fire things (couple of unskilled linos, Catch gobbo, -ma Thrower) and buy a Troll asap


I agree competely. I also see the same three problems,

1) Too many players for such a low TR.
2) Too many important niggled players. (I only keep nigglers if I'm saving my cash for somthing else and i want LOS fodder. Key rule here is that it shouldn't matter if they miss a game)
3) Skilling up the wrong players. It is easy to score with the ball carriers, they get all the skills. Your team becomes unbalanced. Part of the game is working on keeping a balanced team. Then keeping them alive. Note this is a crapload harder then it sounds.

The only other problem I see is that you have low FF, and thus are getting less cash and worse games. If you can cause 2 CAS, or score twice when you lose; then even if you lose every game you will still be able to keep your FF at 9. Win ontop of that and it will go up. For nonbash teams get a DP, but this is ranked and having a DP makes cherrypicking issues.

You will also find that the way you play works better for perticular teams at a perticular rating. So you do better with low rating and win alot - which pushes your rating up as you buy players or whatnot. Then you start to lose.

I hope some of this made sense. Good luck. And remember it is all for fun.
Camy



Joined: Apr 27, 2007

Post   Posted: Sep 13, 2009 - 21:49 Reply with quote Back to top

Experience counts for a lot too.. i was doing worse at the same point in my Fumbbl career (CR Compared).

I've found that sometimes i've known what i really should be doing but havent disciplined myself enough and still go for an unnecessary block or gfi anyway... the less ive done this the more you see the results... if you've not seen it already --> The+Taoch+of+Blood+Bowl
Forteza



Joined: Oct 27, 2006

Post   Posted: Sep 13, 2009 - 22:01 Reply with quote Back to top

I just saw your starting formation from your last replay. Not a very good lineup. You need to make a plan to block down the LoS better, and giving your Big Guy a block with 3 dice. If your lineup sucks the chances are that you wont be succesfull in the game. (I know that helped when I moved from playing badly to decent)
Forteza



Joined: Oct 27, 2006

Post   Posted: Sep 13, 2009 - 22:03 Reply with quote Back to top

Oh yeah and dont use a blitz action to block!!!
Synn



Joined: Dec 13, 2004

Post   Posted: Sep 13, 2009 - 22:11 Reply with quote Back to top

God.. not one person has flamed you.

Fine! I will do it.

You are the reason BetaMax lost out to VHS. I hope you are proud of yourself scumbag.

__Synn
**Actually.... everyone above has covered the issues nicely. Learn from them and you will see yourself do much better Very Happy
spubbbba



Joined: Jul 31, 2006

Post   Posted: Sep 13, 2009 - 22:16 Reply with quote Back to top

Ok, looking at your 3 main teams, they are not terrible but as others have said once you get to this TR you need to keep the teams lean and mean in an open environment. One key thing is at the 150-175 range you need to have a good spread of SPP's skilling up the non positionals will make all the difference between winning and losing.

Orcs
They have too many players, you don't need 2 throwers or gobbos, also you don't need that many linos.
4 Blitzers, 4 BOB's, a thrower (you can get rid of him if you get a couple of AG4 linos/blitzers), a gobbo a troll and 2-3 linos is all you need.

I'd sack the niggled Stand firm BOB now, and one of the gobbos and one of the throwers after the next game. It looks like you have hired some freebooters. Orcs can easily get away with 12-13 players if they are mostly AV9 until you get to 175+ TR

Undead
Team looks ok actually but sack all the coaches and cheerleaders they add little to your team but an extra 8 TR. Your skill choices are mostly good though i like guard 2nd skill on mummies, but hail mary pass is a bad doubles choice for a ghoul guard or mighty blow are better. Once you get to that TR you really need to skill up the zombies or you'll struggle, you need both block and a couple of DP's (bear in mind that will make games harder to find) as well as one with kick.

Like the orcs you can get away with 12-13 players since you have regen skeletons are not great but as you have one with block and the other has SPP's i'd keep them both for now. You might want to sack and replace the HMP ghoul, along with the coaches/cheerleaders that will drop 16 TR and the team will be just as good. If the game is won (or lost) near the end then try to score with zombies (or pass if you can't score), the other players will skill themselves with cas or TD's.

High Elves
Unless you really like the team then you might consider starting over, you have hardly any good skills and with FF6 and 2 niggles it will take some effort to build them back up. Skill choices are good except for leap on the dragon warrior. Not sure if you need 2 throwers but as they are only 10K it's not a terribel choice. If you want to keep them drop the coaches.

if you do start over try the lineman heavy team with 2 re-rolls and 1 or 2 dragon warriors, once you have 12 healthy players start buying re-rolls and replace dead/niggled linos with lion warriors and phoenix warriors. block and dodge should be the main skills with guard on doubles but you've already been doing that.

lizardmen
They are in a real mess with so many niggles, the FF is still decent but you need to replace the krox and saurus asap. As you have a few skilled saurus the team can be saved. Put the niggles on the LOS and don't apoth them.

I'd suggest finding a soft team to get the 30K to replace the krox, then replace the saurus, you might want to sack one of the niggled skinks too since you have 12 players but maybe not yet with one MNG.

Skills look mostly good but DT and SS are the 2 main ones for skinks, a catcher can be useful and i like guard as 1st skill on a krox better than BT


Pro elfs look fine.

oh and human teams should always start with 4 Blitzers, you generally don't need 12 players at the beggining as if one dies in game 1 you can just start over.

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JellyBelly



Joined: Jul 08, 2009

Post   Posted: Sep 13, 2009 - 22:22 Reply with quote Back to top

Thanks for your responses - there are definitely some interesting suggestions there.

All of your points make a lot of sense and I think perhaps I do need to do some re-modelling to prune back some of the teams that are outgrowing their FF.

Undead Team: Yeah, they probably do have too many players, although getting 1 or 2 DPs is fairly high on my agenda. FF 7 is probably way too low for TR165 though, so I guess they need some pruning Smile.

Lizardmen: I really like lizardmen (one of my favourite teams). I think the sauruses are coming along ok, but the skinks probably are developing a bit too quickly. A real pain though are the niggled saurus and kroxigor - the krox niggled today on aging after his second skill roll .... is it really best just to get rid of them? I mean, they've both got 2 skills & they're pretty handy ... perhaps in general I'm hanging on to my nigglers too long .... ? Is it really best to sack them, even if it'll take the team below 11 players and I can't afford to replace them?

Orcs: Yeah, they also have a fairly full roster and again low FF (7) for TR160. I bought one lineorc today & freebooted another because i've got 2 players missing the next game, plus two gobbos, so I wanted to pad out my reserves a bit. But having read your comments though it looks like they need some pruning back as well.

High Elves: These guys have been troubling me for a while now. They have been getting a bit of a raw deal at the hands of some nasty injury dice. I really like the team and I've been trying to rebuild them, but it is proving difficult. What do you think? Are they worth saving? The thing is, I just know that if they can get a couple of good games then they could be on the road to recovery. But ... they have only FF 6 and with the two niggles & the mng it's hard finding a game for them because the chances are they'll be down to 9 players before they even start.

I reckon maybe if I can pick a couple of choice games and earn enough to get rid of one of the niggles and still have 11 players, then try and keep their TR low for a few games to try to increase the FF, then I might be able to fix them. I dunno ... I'll probably give them another couple of games, but I'll definitely retire them if they don't improve soon.

BTW, G_Force, thanks for your advice on the HTML thing - I'll go and fix it now. Cheers! Very Happy
Chewie



Joined: Dec 13, 2006

Post   Posted: Sep 13, 2009 - 22:26 Reply with quote Back to top

pythrr wrote:
Moreover - low TR vs low TR = more reliant upon dice and luck, so newish players can hold their won on average regardless of skill (unless they are really bad, like chewie)


Git Razz
Chewie



Joined: Dec 13, 2006

Post   Posted: Sep 13, 2009 - 22:31 Reply with quote Back to top

Oh, and Jellybelly... don't retire the HE if you really like the team. Most teams have to play shorthanded and they do get better and bounce back, given the necessary ruthlessness.
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