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Carnis



Joined: Feb 03, 2009

Post   Posted: Feb 22, 2012 - 14:30 Reply with quote Back to top

Silly post, didnt read the latest page.. Removing!
Hitonagashi



Joined: Apr 09, 2006

Post   Posted: Feb 22, 2012 - 14:59 Reply with quote Back to top

I like it.

I thought it would be OP at first...but I think it'll run into "Snotling problem"...speed! The team is quite slow, no fast runners. Sure, they can kill stuff with the sidestep stab dude, but he's not better than a chainsaw.

I'd be half tempted to play with only the stab and the lino dude though. Not sure the others are worth the cost.

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WhatBall



Joined: Aug 21, 2008

Post   Posted: Feb 22, 2012 - 15:20 Reply with quote Back to top

Craftnburn wrote:
WhatBall wrote:
I like Bogie, and it is not the same as a Bogle
I was actually was referring to the text itself being too similar. The lowercase i often hard to distinguish from the lowercase l, depending on the font.

Yes, caught that after I posted. I think it is ok though.

Kalamona wrote:
sorry, but this team is way too powerful. just think about it. u have a lineman like:

0-16 Boggarts 6/2/3/6 Wrestle, Foul Appearance, Stunty

This is the backbone of the team. They are not OP, people have to get out of the mentality that every stunty player needs Dodge to start. This changes it up a bit. They also have no apoth or regen.

Kalamona wrote:
0-2 Pranksters 5/1/3/5 Dodge, Side Step, Stunty, Titchy, Stab, Regeneration

with starting ss he is a killing machine. in new teams he can only be taken down by a pow and u need to choose both down result, coz he will stab u every single turn as a push back means nothing to him.

They don't have Regen or SS in the latest version. They will die very quickly with 5AV and always trying to go in and stab people.

Kalamona wrote:
and 4 stronger player (str 3 and 4) makes sure that this team is no way to be out bashed but the same 4 player makes sure that even passing did not work against them.

Check the latest version. The ST3 reduced to ST2. The 2 ST4s were merged into a single ST5, which is weaker overall for the team.

Kalamona wrote:
sorry if i seemed to be negative, but it feels like the team was just put together with some skills and wasn't tested.

As CnB noted, no way to test yet. The best we can do is work through the possible problems here and adjust. I think the latest iteration is a very good proposal. It has great defensive strengths, but will suffer on offence. It will also be a team where there is high turnover, limiting the Wrodge spamming. Even with Wrodge spam, you end up with a lot of your own players on the ground, inviting fouls, and making it hard to move the ball.


To be clear, here is the latest version of the team:

0-1 Bogeyman 5/5/1/9 Disturbing Presence, Foul Appearance, Grab, Loner, Regeneration - SM GAP - 120K
0-2 Bogles 6/2/3/7 Foul Appearance, Jump Up, Leap, Regeneration, Very Long Legs - G ASP - 100K
0-2 Bogies 5/1/3/5 Dodge, Foul Appearance, Stab, Stunty, Titchy - A GSP - 50K
0-16 Boggarts 6/2/3/6 Stunty, Wrestle, Foul Appearance - A GSP - 50K
Apothecary: No
Rerolls: 60K

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WhatBall



Joined: Aug 21, 2008

Post   Posted: Feb 22, 2012 - 19:58 Reply with quote Back to top

Ok, noticed Bogles can be spelled Bogles, Boggles or Bogills. Would Bogills be better to differentiate with Bogies?

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Craftnburn



Joined: Jul 29, 2005

Post   Posted: Feb 22, 2012 - 20:30 Reply with quote Back to top

Of the choices I'd rank them: Boggle>Bogle>Bogill although I'm nust sure if it's really an issue.. the icons and portrait would be different, so the only place you might get confused in on the roster or Buy New Player window, and if you can't tell the difference there, you deserve to get the wrong thing! Wink
Nelphine



Joined: Apr 01, 2011

Post   Posted: Feb 22, 2012 - 20:49 Reply with quote Back to top

i'm a fan of boggle as well
Nelphine



Joined: Apr 01, 2011

Post   Posted: Feb 22, 2012 - 20:55 Reply with quote Back to top

as for av 5 being unplayable: the entire team has foul appearance off the bat. That's 1/6 less damage than normal (and in most stunty games, I see, say, 4-6 guys off the field at half time? so 3-5 for your team); then the lino's get wrestle so that's another huge damage avoider; if you get both down result, you both go down, but no armour roll; so the other team doesn't even get another chance to block you. Of course you can be fouled, but who's going to foul a lino (assuming he doesn't have a lot of spps)?

Your guys are still S2; and even snotlings with av 5 don't go off the field so much that they don't have a team and they only have S1. But snotlings have regen! Not that different - 1/2 their cas are mitigated, which is about 1/2 of the guys going off the field; so compared to an av 5 player, only 3/4 of the snotlings are staying off the field. But wait, foul appearance + wrestle means that 1/6 + 5/36 = 11/36 of all guys going off the field, don't - which means only 2/3 of the boggles are staying off the field. Which means that (with AV 5) you can expect MORE boggles to stay on the field than snotlings - and boggles are S2 to boot! So if snotlings can field a team after half time, then boggarts can field even more guys after half time.

So yes, I do think that AV 5 would be a good compromise for giving boggles wrestle + foul appearance.
Craftnburn



Joined: Jul 29, 2005

Post   Posted: Feb 22, 2012 - 21:06 Reply with quote Back to top

Realize that you are equating a 50K player and a 20K player... (So you need more than twice the number of Snotling off the pitch to equal each boggart!)

Furthermore, Snotlings also have 3 Trolls vs 1 Bogeyman. An unblockable B&C and an AV 10 Deathroller certainly more than counter balance the Bogies and Boggles (sp?).
Nelphine



Joined: Apr 01, 2011

Post   Posted: Feb 22, 2012 - 22:01 Reply with quote Back to top

price has two parts:

cost of replacement (wherein snotlings do have an advantage)

and cost to the team overall (wherein the snotlings have far more expensive positionals; so sure the snots are cheap, but that's because every time a non snotling dies, it takes up their entire treasury to replace it)

so, yes, I think snotlings are cheaper, and probably have the advantage pricewise - but boggles are strength 2. they are NOT going to get knocked down as often. In fact, it is reasonable that close to twice as many snotlings will get knocked down in a given game as boggles, before accounting for the respective 'stay alive' skills each has.

the boggart team is cheap enough that you shouldn't have a problem fielding a full team of 13-15, even with deaths; and therefore the price argument, in a given particular game, is somewhat moot. boggles simply aren't going to get knocked down that often; and unlike a snotling, the boggles 'stay alive' skills also help prevent: stuns, knockdowns, and positioning.

The boggle will not be a bashy team; but they will be extremely good at neutralizing bashy teams. However, as long as people are willing to revise things after testing, I can live with trying it out; I was simply trying to offer a compromise because I really do think wrodge is going to be scary in Stunty Leeg.
Craftnburn



Joined: Jul 29, 2005

Post   Posted: Feb 22, 2012 - 22:34 Reply with quote Back to top

Ok, you confused me a bit with your use of "Boggle".. but I think I've figured out where you mean Boggart and where you meant Bogeys. Wink (hopefully this isn't indicative of the amount of confusion the position names will cause).

BTW the positionals are 500K (for Snots 5x100) and 420K (for Bogeys 1x120+2x100+2x50) but the Bogeys pay 2.5 times for each of the lineman!


Last edited by Craftnburn on Feb 22, 2012 - 22:39; edited 1 time in total
Nelphine



Joined: Apr 01, 2011

Post   Posted: Feb 22, 2012 - 22:36 Reply with quote Back to top

wow, yeah I just re-read that, and boy did I screw up the names. My bad.
WhatBall



Joined: Aug 21, 2008

Post   Posted: Feb 27, 2012 - 15:59 Reply with quote Back to top

I just updated the first post with the most recent team and fluffed up the fluff even more. Thanks to all for helping improve and balance this team.

Icons on the way shortly...

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Craftnburn



Joined: Jul 29, 2005

Post   Posted: Feb 27, 2012 - 16:03 Reply with quote Back to top

If I ask very nicely could you edit it to the conventional top-down Price/Availability format? Wink

Roster
0-1 Bogeyman 5/5/1/9 Disturbing Presence, Foul Appearance, Grab, Loner, Regeneration - SM GAP - 120K
0-2 Boggles 6/2/3/7 Foul Appearance, Jump Up, Leap, Very Long Legs, Regeneration - G ASP - 100K
0-2 Bogies 5/1/3/5 Dodge, Foul Appearance, Stab, Stunty, Titchy - A GSP - 50K
0-16 Boggarts 6/2/3/6 Stunty, Wrestle, Foul Appearance - A GSP - 50K
Apothecary: No
Rerolls: 60K
WhatBall



Joined: Aug 21, 2008

Post   Posted: Feb 27, 2012 - 16:07 Reply with quote Back to top

Craftnburn wrote:
If I ask very nicely could you edit it to the conventional top-down Price/Availability format? Wink

Roster
0-1 Bogeyman 5/5/1/9 Disturbing Presence, Foul Appearance, Grab, Loner, Regeneration - SM GAP - 120K
0-2 Boggles 6/2/3/7 Foul Appearance, Jump Up, Leap, Very Long Legs, Regeneration - G ASP - 100K
0-2 Bogies 5/1/3/5 Dodge, Foul Appearance, Stab, Stunty, Titchy - A GSP - 50K
0-16 Boggarts 6/2/3/6 Stunty, Wrestle, Foul Appearance - A GSP - 50K
Apothecary: No
Rerolls: 60K


Laughing
Funny thing is, I remember you asking that before, so I took my final list above, and inverted it, thinking I hadn't yet. Will refix it.

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Sigmar1



Joined: Aug 13, 2008

Post   Posted: Feb 29, 2012 - 16:56 Reply with quote Back to top

This is looking pretty good Whatball...close enough to balanced to deserve a shot at playtesting IMO.

Now come give the Colleges of Magic team (suggested rename: Wizard's Guild) thread some love. Me and Aflo appear to be down to the final few tweaks to finalize and we just need to get a bit of a consensus regarding the last few suggestions.

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