Zlefin
Joined: Apr 14, 2005
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 Posted:
Dec 16, 2020 - 21:50 |
 
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I've been wondering lately how large a bench people find optimal for those running minmax'ed TV optimized box teams (optimized for win rate). I just don't have the long term box experience to feel sure. I ran an orc team for a bit, just at 11 players, and it seemed good.
It seems like running a minimal bench is good for many teams, as you can run very effective skilled but lean teams; and keeping the TV down has a big effect due to TV-based matchmaking.
Of course having little or no bench can mean running men down at times, which can be very hard on some teams.
So how many players to run for say, orcs, humans, shambling undead, skaven, dwarves, elves (of each kind)?
how lean is too lean? |
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MattDakka
Joined: Oct 09, 2007
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| Posted:
Dec 16, 2020 - 21:53 |
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Orcs: low TV 11-12, mid TV 12-13
Humans: low TV 11-12, mid TV 13-14
Undead: low TV 11-12, mid TV 13-14
Dwarfs: low TV 11-12, mid TV 12-13
Skaven: low TV 11-12, mid TV 13-14
Elves: low TV 11-12, mid TV 12-13 (hard to have more than 13 Elves)
It's hard to give an accurate number because it's a bit roster-dependant, for example, Orcs with a Troll are different than Orcs without a Troll, Humans with an Ogre are different than Humans without Ogre.
Without a Big Guy you can have a longer bench.
Also, if you foul a lot, for example with Undead, you need 14 players, otherwise 13 are enough.
Generally speaking, at mid TV a team with AV 9 on most players is fine with 12-13 players, AV 8 13-14. |
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ArrestedDevelopment
Joined: Sep 14, 2015
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Dec 16, 2020 - 22:11 |
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Varies entirely based on upon which TV you are at, and how many rerolls you carry: you can consider every player who is in contact on the pitch a % of a reroll, in the sense you might need one to move him, or burn one of your opponent's when he blocks - as such a very low reroll team may substitute having a low cost bench player for having a team reroll as you expect to receive an extra cas or two a game simply by having to accept contact at times.
It's very much a judgement call based on race, experience/comfort/ability playing down men etc. The efficiency of each team is also a big factor.
An orc team with 11 men up to around 1350-1400 is in okay shape in many games, but above that it's already a bit of a liability. Undead, necro should seek to go to 12 asap imo as zombies are easily removed. Elves... imo every single elf is worth more than a babe/2-3 skills on oppo and bench on elves is pretty much what you want, where you need to be careful there is adding excess positionals and rerolls too quickly, staying low on elves is actually suboptimal unless you intend to run a very low positional build, but these all tend to require very strong positioning as you're usually removing high MA pieces or those with pitch control (witch elf) from the mix by doing so.
It should also be added the box is not completely strictly tv-matched and employing these strategies is no guarantee you find yourself against a weaker team. You may find yourself playing uphill against a team built similarly to yourself or even just loaded with skills, at which point your lack of a bench and/or rerolls will usually not be overcome with inducements on many races.
In the end, playing the scheduler is never going to be a substitute for actual ability really. |
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