Grasshugger17
Joined: Jun 29, 2020
|
 Posted:
Dec 29, 2020 - 12:16 |
 
|
I have never coached Dorf and no amount of 'goodness' will ever change that! |
|
|
King_Ghidra
Joined: Sep 14, 2009
|
| Posted:
Dec 29, 2020 - 12:35 |
|
| Lyracian wrote: |
This is my thought. I am expecting 80-90% of the meta to be the same six teams. |
There's absolutely no way this is going to happen. For a few reasons:
1) People will play teams they think are fun or cool regardless of competitiveness
2) People are not good judges of what is competitive
3) People will always crave a challenge, variety, or be playing some kid of meta group that encourages the same
To expand a little:
1) Look at the data for box in the bb2016 era. Teams like Amazons and Woodies have a fantastic win rate and low /relatively low representation. Teams like Chaos and Orcs have a low win rate and huge representation.
2) Even at the very height of clawpomb hysteria, there was little evidence clawpomb was as effective as say, AG4, for actually winning games. but it was easier and "men go sploosh lol" so people played it.
We endlessly hear how 'broken' dwarves are but at least until very high tv there is no tv range where they exceed Undead, Lizards or Zons, but for whatever reason no one wants to talk about those teams.
If we do end up moving to a min-max meta with seasons, then it seems likely a broad range of teams will be competitively viable as they will all be developing their key ball carrier, hitter, fouler, whatever and will look increasingly similar. Maybe some teams and environment combos will turn out to be very effective, we all certainly have a lot to learn and test before determining that. |
|
|
ClayInfinity
Joined: Aug 15, 2003
|
| Posted:
Dec 29, 2020 - 13:29 |
|
| King_Ghidra wrote: | | Lyracian wrote: |
This is my thought. I am expecting 80-90% of the meta to be the same six teams. |
There's absolutely no way this is going to happen. For a few reasons:
1) People will play teams they think are fun or cool regardless of competitiveness
2) People are not good judges of what is competitive
3) People will always crave a challenge, variety, or be playing some kid of meta group that encourages the same
To expand a little:
1) Look at the data for box in the bb2016 era. Teams like Amazons and Woodies have a fantastic win rate and low /relatively low representation. Teams like Chaos and Orcs have a low win rate and huge representation.
2) Even at the very height of clawpomb hysteria, there was little evidence clawpomb was as effective as say, AG4, for actually winning games. but it was easier and "men go sploosh lol" so people played it.
We endlessly hear how 'broken' dwarves are but at least until very high tv there is no tv range where they exceed Undead, Lizards or Zons, but for whatever reason no one wants to talk about those teams.
If we do end up moving to a min-max meta with seasons, then it seems likely a broad range of teams will be competitively viable as they will all be developing their key ball carrier, hitter, fouler, whatever and will look increasingly similar. Maybe some teams and environment combos will turn out to be very effective, we all certainly have a lot to learn and test before determining that. |
Agree. There is always the randomness of human nature. Then add into all the above said by King G, there will also be the people who will have the random skills for the TV saving, but less effective on the pitch.
Also, the random MVP will put paid to the focused development of players too... so the Killer/Baller/Fouler combo will be harder to achieve in the random MVP era. |
|
|
Lyracian
Joined: Oct 29, 2015
|
| Posted:
Dec 29, 2020 - 14:27 |
|
| King_Ghidra wrote: | There's absolutely no way this is going to happen. For a few reasons:
|
I am perhaps being a little overly dramatic. My numbers are of course not realists and were done to emphasis a point. To expand however it is my expectation that the majority of Black Box teams will gravitate to a small number of races. I know I will be. In about 9 months we should know if that is the same for others.
| gansus wrote: | I have always thought dwarves are pretty broken, as you also think, but I have felt pretty alone in this romm 
he shows dwarves were the only team they had to break their own rules to give a value to players with |
They always seemed an odd set of starting skills. Dwarf teams still had 40k TRR until LRB 5. I guess it must be GW's favorite race. |
|
|
MattDakka
Joined: Oct 09, 2007
|
| Posted:
Dec 29, 2020 - 15:10 |
|
GW magazine is called "White Dwarf". Just a coincidence? |
|
|
AzraelEVA
Joined: Nov 14, 2015
|
| Posted:
Dec 29, 2020 - 15:57 |
|
| MattDakka wrote: | | But not reliable in the most common block actions. So, no. Either Block or Wrestle. |
The reliability of a knockdown with 2d Block with Block vs Pro
Block = 75%
Pro = 80% |
|
|
MattDakka
Joined: Oct 09, 2007
|
| Posted:
Dec 29, 2020 - 16:13 |
|
If you use a rr Block is more reliable, also, it increases Both Down knockdowns.
Also, I don't think you are going to use Pro if you fail an early block on your turn. |
|
|
AzraelEVA
Joined: Nov 14, 2015
|
| Posted:
Dec 29, 2020 - 16:18 |
|
But you use pro if only one of your dice shows push |
|
|
MattDakka
Joined: Oct 09, 2007
|
| Posted:
Dec 29, 2020 - 17:13 |
|
And what if your dice show both down-skull, both down-both down, or skull-skull?
Do you risk to rr with Pro without using a rr? Really? At start of turn or early in the turn? |
|
|
Lyracian
Joined: Oct 29, 2015
|
| Posted:
Dec 29, 2020 - 17:31 |
|
Pro will be a fine random skill on lineo. Block/Wrestle also work on defence |
_________________
Nuffle wills it.
Lyracian. |
|
Craftnburn
Joined: Jul 29, 2005
|
| Posted:
Jan 10, 2021 - 19:58 |
|
1. Developing teams is about building a 'story', If all players only last 1 or 2 seasons, you might as well just call them Blitzer1 and Lineman1 (etc.), or heck why not just Knights and Pawns. 
2. With the crippling of the passing game, this just becomes Murderball and while injuries and deaths certainly occur, I don't want to be required to destroy my opponent's team in order to win.
3. I've been playing this game for over 30 years...maybe it's time I moved on. |
|
|
TrashMouse
Joined: Nov 28, 2009
|
| Posted:
Jan 10, 2021 - 21:54 |
|
Craftnburn, try the new ruleset first before settling on something. Leagues can set their own rulesets for re-drafting. |
|
|
gamelsetlmatch
Joined: Mar 05, 2013
|
| Posted:
Jan 10, 2021 - 22:19 |
|
| stej wrote: | I'm surprised GW don't put together stadiums / dugouts / crowd models to bump up the number of things people would buy.
You may only need 16 players for a team, but you'll need a few 100 figures to make a good crowd |
get a fan for each fan factor to place on your choice of the sideline and get a +1 to injury if you surf in a square he touches!! |
_________________
Stargate!
“In our play we reveal what kind of people we are.” |
|
Craftnburn
Joined: Jul 29, 2005
|
| Posted:
Jan 11, 2021 - 01:20 |
|
| Foremole wrote: | | Craftnburn, try the new ruleset first before settling on something. Leagues can set their own rulesets for re-drafting. |
I understand that #1 can be mitigated in League, but #2 can't be... Wildly Inaccurate scattering from the thrower instead of the target and Elves (Catchers) throwing as well as Dwarves (Lineman) just shows that whoever was doing these rule changes is pretty clueless. |
|
|
MattDakka
Joined: Oct 09, 2007
|
| Posted:
Jan 11, 2021 - 12:23 |
|
Considering that throwing the ball is rare in BB2016 it should not make a big difference in BB2020, passing will be either an emergency solution or vanity in not important turns, so Wildly Inaccurate should not matter as much as you think, unless you want to pass more than once in a drive.
The bigger concern in my opinion is facing an endless series of Dwarfs, Chaos Dwarfs, Norse, Orcs and fewer differences in rosters' builds, boring.
Also, while CRP high TV was Murderball I don't think BB2020 without Piling On and with Claw nerf will be Murderball. |
|
|
|
|
| |
All Star Bowl!
Search
