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Kinks



Joined: Feb 28, 2007

Post   Posted: Jan 27, 2022 - 07:44 Reply with quote Back to top

MrCushtie wrote:
I had somebody tell me the opposite to Tussock's reasoning, and they were quite vociferous that at the point of activation, an Ogre that's boneheaded from his previous turn isn't boneheaded any more (so they have their tackle zones back and can use Pro), and then (assuming they bonehead again, lose their tackle zones once more).


That's the way I see it, although I can see how it would make sense if a troll continued to be stupid, rather than having a second of awareness before drifting into stupidity again. However, if a troll was hypnotised, wouldn't it make sense that he recovered from being hypnotised before he had chance to be stupid?

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JanMattys



Joined: Feb 29, 2004

Post   Posted: Jan 27, 2022 - 11:12 Reply with quote Back to top

Also, you probably know that, but just yesterday I wrongly reported a bug because Pro wasn't used when a played handoffed the ball to the Pro teammate.
Pro only works if it's the active player, so you can't reroll a failed catch with pro because it's the handoffer/passer's turn, not the Pro's.

(I believe it was C0ddlefish who corrected me in the discord chat - thanks!)

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koadah



Joined: Mar 30, 2005

Post   Posted: Jan 27, 2022 - 14:27 Reply with quote Back to top

I've always assumed that the negatraits were for a turn. The next turn, you would roll to see if the player is affected again rather than to see if the effect is removed.

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garyt1



Joined: Mar 12, 2011

Post   Posted: Jan 27, 2022 - 16:09 Reply with quote Back to top

JanMattys wrote:

Pro only works if it's the active player, so you can't reroll a failed catch with pro because it's the handoffer/passer's turn, not the Pro's.

(I believe it was C0ddlefish who corrected me in the discord chat - thanks!)

Interesting, I would have thought before that Pro could be used for catches (if the player hasn't used it already that turn). Good to know.

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koadah



Joined: Mar 30, 2005

Post   Posted: Jan 27, 2022 - 17:02 Reply with quote Back to top

garyt1 wrote:
JanMattys wrote:

Pro only works if it's the active player, so you can't reroll a failed catch with pro because it's the handoffer/passer's turn, not the Pro's.

(I believe it was C0ddlefish who corrected me in the discord chat - thanks!)

Interesting, I would have thought before that Pro could be used for catches (if the player hasn't used it already that turn). Good to know.


Is this another change by the anti-passing brigade?

Maybe they didn't like people winning games passing between orc blitzers.

I didn't realise that people were abusing pro that often.

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JanMattys



Joined: Feb 29, 2004

Post   Posted: Jan 27, 2022 - 17:41 Reply with quote Back to top

garyt1 wrote:
JanMattys wrote:

Pro only works if it's the active player, so you can't reroll a failed catch with pro because it's the handoffer/passer's turn, not the Pro's.

(I believe it was C0ddlefish who corrected me in the discord chat - thanks!)

Interesting, I would have thought before that Pro could be used for catches (if the player hasn't used it already that turn). Good to know.


My guess is you can only reroll a catch with Pro if the Pro player hands the ball to another teammate, the catch fails and the ball scatters on the Pro player. Or if you blitz with a Pro player, and the ball scatters on the blitzer. Otherwise, the catch happens during another player's activation.

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Sp00keh



Joined: Dec 06, 2011

Post   Posted: Jan 27, 2022 - 17:56 Reply with quote Back to top

koadah wrote:
I've always assumed that the negatraits were for a turn. The next turn, you would roll to see if the player is affected again rather than to see if the effect is removed.


Yea I agree with this
Negatraits are written like:

"when activated... immediately after declaring action .. but before performing it.. roll D6"
"On a roll of 1 .. activation ends immediately. Additionally, this player loses their tackle zone until they are next activated"


Activation is "during your team turn, you may activate each standing and/or prone player..."

So it sounds like each turn, you can activate a negatrait-failed player, who then can declare an action, (so regains his tacklezones) fail the negatrait again, and then ends his activation (and loses his tacklezones again)


C0ddlefish wrote:
Pro only works if you have a tacklezone

Kinks wrote:
That's right, pro no longer works when you are prone.

Pro works "During their activation.."
So I disagree with both of these statements. There's no requirement for either having tacklezones or being Standing / not-Prone


Last edited by Sp00keh on Jan 27, 2022 - 18:15; edited 1 time in total
Kinks



Joined: Feb 28, 2007

Post   Posted: Jan 27, 2022 - 18:14 Reply with quote Back to top

koadah wrote:
I've always assumed that the negatraits were for a turn. The next turn, you would roll to see if the player is affected again rather than to see if the effect is removed.

It’s until they are activated. If you fail BH/RS on turn 1 and don’t reactivate them they will remain that way for the rest of the half.

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C0ddlefish



Joined: Sep 17, 2019

Post   Posted: Jan 27, 2022 - 18:19 Reply with quote Back to top

I'm just passing on my interpretation of what Christer has said on Discord. We all agree the GW wording is rubbish for clarity.

Currently the interpretation for Fumbbl seems to be Activation only start after you *DO* an action not just declare it. Otherwise there would be no need to click the 'Recover from Hypnogaze button'.

Similarly if you selected a player then deselect it, then you wouldn't be able to reselect them and do an action later in the turn
Kondor



Joined: Apr 04, 2008

Post   Posted: Jan 27, 2022 - 19:51 Reply with quote Back to top

You know....I love this game but sometimes I am really glad that I don't have the chance to play tabletop with serious players. I'd say go with the most common sense understanding of what is meant. Agree with your buddy and have everyone play it that way.

I am also glad that the Fumbbl client enforces the same rules upon everyone so that in game there is no use arguing about it. The commissioner has made a ruling and everyone lives by it.

Rules lawyers are the worst.
Christer



Joined: Aug 02, 2003

Post   Posted: Jan 27, 2022 - 22:04
FUMBBL Staff
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C0ddlefish wrote:
I'm just passing on my interpretation of what Christer has said on Discord. We all agree the GW wording is rubbish for clarity.


To be clear, the Discord chat was regarding Pro use from prone, which I feel currently is not allowed. Pro to recover from really stupid (or other negatrait things) is a slightly different situation.
C0ddlefish



Joined: Sep 17, 2019

Post   Posted: Jan 27, 2022 - 22:30 Reply with quote Back to top

Sorry yes that's fair.

Personally I'm still happy with the current interpretation in-game for Pro and the negatraits in absence of any other GW guidance.

As Kondor implies above as long as it's consistent for everyone then it's all good
Kinks



Joined: Feb 28, 2007

Post   Posted: Jan 27, 2022 - 22:41 Reply with quote Back to top

So the way I see it:

1) Activate the troll - instantly recovers from RS/Hypno.
2) Declare an action: Blitz/Block/TTM/etc (currently activate with tackle zones, unless prone)
3) Roll for RS.

As you can see, from my view, there is a small window when a troll recovers from RS/Hypno, before rolling again.

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C0ddlefish



Joined: Sep 17, 2019

Post   Posted: Jan 27, 2022 - 23:01 Reply with quote Back to top

I don't think anyone can say that definitely isn't how it should be because GW haven't been clear.

It still boils down to when "activation" starts: prior to declaration of an action, after declaring an action but prior to doing it, or at the point of actually starting the action.

Your version in the client here would means as soon as you click on a player they are active (so no deselecting and coming back to it later) which I just don't like personally. But it would mean getting rid of the 'Recover from Hypno' button.

On table top that would presumably mean first declaring you are activating a player, then subsequently declaring what their action will be.
Kinks



Joined: Feb 28, 2007

Post   Posted: Jan 27, 2022 - 23:45 Reply with quote Back to top

C0ddlefish wrote:
I don't think anyone can say that definitely isn't how it should be because GW haven't been clear.

Totally agree.

C0ddlefish wrote:
Your version in the client here would means as soon as you click on a player they are active (so no deselecting and coming back to it later) which I just don't like personally. But it would mean getting rid of the 'Recover from Hypno' button.

I don't think so. It could be left exactly the same way it is. I don't consider clicking a player activating them, I would assume that activating them happens automatically, when a coach selects an action they would technically be activating the player, then declaring an action, which would be irrelevant most of the time. It's not worth adding a tedious extra layer, in the same way we don't need to click each square moved or move the turn counter.

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