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Poll
Can you think of any other hidden benefits of skills, inducements or stars for example, which aren't stated but still impact positively on the game for the coach who has them?
Yes
33%
 33%  [ 5 ]
No
6%
 6%  [ 1 ]
Think?
60%
 60%  [ 9 ]
Total Votes : 15


Malmir



Joined: May 20, 2008

Post   Posted: Jun 20, 2022 - 20:20 Reply with quote Back to top

This thread is a result of this post from the 'Best Combo pass' thread, which got me thinking...

Quote:
This also got me thinking about hidden benefits and needing to weigh those up when evaluating a skill's usefulness The obvious example is a wizard, where every turn I don't use it but you think I might and so adapt your position accordingly (e.g. having an extra man around the cage who could be doing something annoying somewhere else) is a gain I've made even though the wizard hasn't directly done anything. I think cannoneer might have something similar. Firstly it gives more options which keeps the opponent guessing. I might not launch that long pass, but knowing I'm decent odds if I do means you have to factor it in.

Let's imagine a hypothetical situation where you are trying to stall but it's getting risky. Do you score turn 7 and give me two turns. Never ideal against elves anyway, but no matter where you kick it I'm looking at a 3+ pass with rr to get it to someone with cannoneer (at worst). Maybe you decide it's worth the risky stall and I turn it over anyway and with elves there is still a decent chance I score too and go in 1-0 up rather than 1-1, which is the worst it could be had you scored. Just my thoughts, which brings me to this thread...

Can you think of any other hidden benefits of skills, inducements or stars for example, which aren't stated but still impact positively on the game for the coach who has them?
Malmir



Joined: May 20, 2008

Post   Posted: Jun 20, 2022 - 20:24 Reply with quote Back to top

Jan Mattys wrote:
Crowd control and clock control are king in this game, as I'm pretty sure you alread know lol. The same goes for skills like Frenzy. Just the fact that you have it, theoretically shrinks the width from your opponent from 24x15 to 22x13, which is huge in itself purely from a tactical point of view.


Good shout. Obviously one I am familiar with but definitely worth mentioning.
JanMattys



Joined: Feb 29, 2004

Post   Posted: Jun 20, 2022 - 20:27 Reply with quote Back to top

Bribes also condition your positioning. Leaving a key player to be surrounded can be a bait when there's no dp. But with dp and/or a bribe, you're pretty much forced to deny those +5/+6 assists.

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MattDakka



Joined: Oct 09, 2007

Post   Posted: Jun 20, 2022 - 20:35 Reply with quote Back to top

Bomber has hidden benefits. Maybe my opponent will not throw a bomb every turn, but I have to consider that possibility, for example if I run with a half cage along a side line.
He's even cheaper than a Wizard.

Akhorne too has some potential. I remember 1 game where he 1d powed my Blodger Catcher in a cage.
Again, maybe my opponent will not blitz every turn with him, but it's something I have to consider.
He has also Frenzy, which can be a surf threat.
C0ddlefish



Joined: Sep 17, 2019

Post   Posted: Jun 20, 2022 - 21:02 Reply with quote Back to top

New Norse stars - the 'move a player 1 extra square' guy means you need to think more about positioning every turn to not effectively give up a second Blitz. And the Barrel guy acts kinda like the bomber/wizard defined above.
PeteW



Joined: Aug 05, 2005

Post   Posted: Jun 20, 2022 - 23:15 Reply with quote Back to top

Leap on a trollslayer.

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Azur



Joined: Nov 13, 2020

Post   Posted: Jun 21, 2022 - 00:36 Reply with quote Back to top

Dribblesnot's special ability is now implemented on Fumbbl.

Make him throw a bomb right in the middle of an elven cage.
The ball carrier catched the bomb thx to his superior agility?
Excellent!
Trigger "Kaboom!", and everybody's down in the cage. Maybe even off/injured/dead.
Send your gutter runner, pick up the ball in the middle of the corpses, get away.

only 50k, available in any Green Skin armoury.

It's possible only once per game, but.... damn! What a "hidden" benefit!!
Joost



Joined: Mar 17, 2014

Post   Posted: Jun 21, 2022 - 09:44 Reply with quote Back to top

Negatraits like Bonehead on Ogres to me have the hidden benefit of forcing me to concentrate on positioning because the risk of something going unplanned is ever present. They keep me (a bit) from playing a more risky game that is not fundamentally sound.
Java



Joined: Jan 27, 2018

Post   Posted: Jun 21, 2022 - 10:48 Reply with quote Back to top

the "bb20 bad!" thread is the one opened by mekutata

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Verminardo



Joined: Sep 27, 2006

Post   Posted: Jun 21, 2022 - 11:37 Reply with quote Back to top

Isn't this just a function of how impactful a certain skill or trait potentially is? Like, I have to account for every single skill, stat or trait on any of your players in my positioning, all of the time. Whether you have Block or not may change my decision to mark you. Whether you have an additional Guard may change my decision to go full contact. You having a Tackler will make me consider his potential to hurt my Dodgers. Back in the days of CPOMB positioning became a lot about the CPOMBer. To a degree it now is with DP/SG. So what you're really asking is, which skills or traits have a particularly high disruptive potential, right?

In the old rules I would have said Hypnotic Gaze and Leap/Wrestle/Strip for sure. Probably still true in the new rules to an extent but since I'm still not sure I know what the rules for either are, I can't really say... Laughing
Nelphine



Joined: Apr 01, 2011

Post   Posted: Jun 21, 2022 - 14:50 Reply with quote Back to top

gaze is even stronger than before - it both works more often, and it negates a lot of skills (like block and dodge) making it very very powerful if you target the ball carrier with it
MattDakka



Joined: Oct 09, 2007

Post   Posted: Jun 21, 2022 - 14:52 Reply with quote Back to top

Yes, too bad that Vampires are weaker than before due to Season Re-Draft, random MVP and skill-up system.
Not to mention passing (a Vampire with either Strong Arm or AG 5 could have been used as Thrower in CRP).
Cerberus85



Joined: May 06, 2017

Post   Posted: Jun 21, 2022 - 15:44 Reply with quote Back to top

I'd have to say from a personal standpoint that Disturbing Presence was one that I've fallen foul of several times.

Not only its cumulative effects but that the skill works from players who are prone / stunned.

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Verminardo



Joined: Sep 27, 2006

Post   Posted: Jun 21, 2022 - 18:40 Reply with quote Back to top

Cerberus85 wrote:
I'd have to say from a personal standpoint that Disturbing Presence was one that I've fallen foul of several times.

Not only its cumulative effects but that the skill works from players who are prone / stunned.


That's not really a hidden benefit / secondary effect though, that's kind of just what the skill does in the first place. Wink
Gary_Gygax



Joined: Aug 08, 2003

Post   Posted: Jun 21, 2022 - 19:18 Reply with quote Back to top

PeteW wrote:
Leap on a trollslayer.


Love that, of course Smile
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