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Nekojin



Joined: Feb 24, 2023

Post   Posted: Jul 01, 2023 - 02:41 Reply with quote Back to top

One of my Ghouls took an injury last game. It already had a Niggling Injury, but seems to have acquired a second Niggling.

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Does the effect of NIs stack?
Nelphine



Joined: Apr 01, 2011

Post   Posted: Jul 01, 2023 - 02:41 Reply with quote Back to top

Yes
Nightbird



Joined: Aug 02, 2003

Post   Posted: Jul 01, 2023 - 02:46 Reply with quote Back to top

Nekojin wrote:
One of my Ghouls took an injury last game. It already had a Niggling Injury, but seems to have acquired a second Niggling.

Image

Does the effect of NIs stack?


+2
He's FIRED Exclamation

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Chingis



Joined: Jul 09, 2007

Post   Posted: Jul 01, 2023 - 03:50 Reply with quote Back to top

That's the beauty of the niggling injuries in the new rules. The more you get, the worse every subsequent injury you get is likely to be. So they will snowball, until your player dies/suffers career ending stat decreases under the weight of those little niggles which accumulate.

You don't even need bother firing them, accumulating NIs will ensure their quicker demise on the pitch, without affecting their playing ability before they do get "retired" by the dice! (It doesn't make them any more likely to get CAS-ed in a particular game, only makes the long term "ramifications" of that CAS worse) Very Happy
MattDakka



Joined: Oct 09, 2007

Post   Posted: Jul 01, 2023 - 11:43 Reply with quote Back to top

It's better to fire players before they stack too many NIs. That way it's easier to keep them in game (because BH is more likely without NI, and Apo on BH is automatically successful).
I fire my players with 2+ NIs.

And no, it's not a good system. A system where SI and Death are 62.5% it's not a good one.
BH should be 50%, SI and Death 50%.
Chingis



Joined: Jul 09, 2007

Post   Posted: Jul 01, 2023 - 16:18 Reply with quote Back to top

Yep, you're completely right there's an edge case interaction with the apothecary.

In an apothecary-less context my original summary holds. An if you have an apothecary, it depends how you tend to use them. I almost never use an apothecary on BH/KOs: I tend to save them for preventing death/stat decreases and *maybe* sometimes preventing NIs (near the end of the game/on a favourite player only). But yes, if you use your apothecary more for keeping players on the pitch in the current game rather than protecting your players from permanent damage, then you might want to fire niggling injuries as described.

So because I'm more worried about long term injuries, I tend to mentally split the casualty table into different categories. Rather than:
BH 37.5%:
SI/Death 62.5%

I see it as:
No permanent damage 62.5%
No permanent damage, but reduction of lifespan (NI) 12.5%
Permanent damage/death 25%.

(That last category, which is the important one to me, gets bigger every time the player gets an NI of course!)
MattDakka



Joined: Oct 09, 2007

Post   Posted: Jul 01, 2023 - 17:40 Reply with quote Back to top

Most of times I'm interested only in the tactical use of the Apo, i.e. healing a player for the game I'm currently playing.
Long term is a consideration only when the injured player is very important (such as a SI/Killed Legend ball carrier).
The best Apo use is generally on KO and BH, so I don't want to have a lower BH chance (due to NIs) on an important player.

I wrote a blog about NIs, if you are interested in the odds:
https://fumbbl.com/p/blog&c=MattDakka&id=24239


As an aside, I'd rather a Casualty table like this, which would make the tactical Apo better (because BH is 50% chance):

Casualty Table (D16)
1-8: Badly Hurt
9-10: Seriously Hurt (MNG)
11-12: Seriously Injured (NI)*
13-14: Lasting Injury (-Stat)
15-16: Dead

*Each Niggling Injury adds +2 to D16 roll on Casualty Table
JanMattys



Joined: Feb 29, 2004

Post   Posted: Jul 01, 2023 - 19:20 Reply with quote Back to top

First of all, niggled players now are perfectly fine on the pitch till they get an injury, so I wouldn't sack him.
My advice is: work on the playbook to protect him more. I don't want to sound patronising so please take this in stride, but if your necro ghoul ballcarrier suffered two casualties in ten games, chances are you need to learn not to put him in certain places.

Maybe if you practice by keeping him with his +2 to the injury table, the heightened feeling of dread about his possible demise will help you focus on a better positioning?

I'd try. The worst thing that can happen is that he dies on the pitch or gets something truly careeer-ending, like -ag or -ma.

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MattDakka



Joined: Oct 09, 2007

Post   Posted: Jul 01, 2023 - 19:51 Reply with quote Back to top

The sooner you fire a niggled player, the sooner you build a new one.
Personally I don't like to build castles on sand.
JanMattys



Joined: Feb 29, 2004

Post   Posted: Jul 01, 2023 - 19:57 Reply with quote Back to top

Bloodbowl is an infinite plain of sand. Thinking there's sand and there's reliable terrain is an illusion. But to each his own.

That's a league player. Having surehands and sidestep probably makes him worth more than a new ghoul, and also saves money that could be needed for more important casualties. If you burn money for a new ghoul while the previous one is perfectly serviceable, Nuffle will reward you with a dead wolf next game, just to teach you a lesson in humility.

That's a player that will be cut off the roster at the end of the season, not during the current one.

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MerryZ



Joined: Nov 28, 2005

Post   Posted: Jul 01, 2023 - 20:39 Reply with quote Back to top

There is really no reason to fire player just because niggling injury.

Only reason I can think of why someone would fire just because niggle is if he just wants to farm games in perpetual league and to 99% of bloodbowl players that just sounds stupid.

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Gridironman



Joined: Mar 18, 2022

Post   Posted: Jul 01, 2023 - 20:56 Reply with quote Back to top

Eh, I say enjoy him while you can but train up a replacement. If you are in a league with FA then you probably ought to dump him off with immediacy.

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MattDakka



Joined: Oct 09, 2007

Post   Posted: Jul 01, 2023 - 21:29 Reply with quote Back to top

I didn't know he was a player in a private league (there is no mention about it in the first post). I thought he was in Competitive.
Then I agree about keeping him (assuming Season's end is near).
Gridironman



Joined: Mar 18, 2022

Post   Posted: Jul 01, 2023 - 22:08 Reply with quote Back to top

My assumption is that it is a competitive division team. He will need to retain him in competitive until he stops moving for good. Unfortunately, it may be worthwhile to put him behind a screen on both sides of the ball. He may blitz or scoop up off a blitz--although there are probably better blitzing units on the team. He can still be a handoff option but is safest as a primary ball handler. Since this is a rogue-like game, we need to come to terms with that some of your guys are going to leave eventually.

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JanMattys



Joined: Feb 29, 2004

Post   Posted: Jul 01, 2023 - 22:19 Reply with quote Back to top

Gridironman wrote:
My assumption is that it is a competitive division team. He will need to retain him in competitive until he stops moving for good. Unfortunately, it may be worthwhile to put him behind a screen on both sides of the ball. He may blitz or scoop up off a blitz--although there are probably better blitzing units on the team. He can still be a handoff option but is safest as a primary ball handler. Since this is a rogue-like game, we need to come to terms with that some of your guys are going to leave eventually.


The player is from OP's necro team, which is a League team currently in a league.

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