Angmarred
Joined: Feb 28, 2015
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 Posted:
Apr 02, 2015 - 16:54 |
 
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This game. Half 1, I allow a quick score. I grind back and force my tying score a turn early and allow an easy two turner for him to take the lead back. Half 2, despite my best efforts to lose, I manage to score on turn 8. A riot (obviously) pushes it back to 7. I'm in my stop OTS formation and am not sure what I should have done to prevent the 2 turner. Start of my turn 7, what should I have done? |
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licker
Joined: Jul 10, 2009
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Apr 02, 2015 - 17:02 |
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Without watching the replay I'd say that allowing a quick score may not have been the best idea in a matchup of humans vs. CD. CD can (usually) play defense pretty well.
I don't know if you had to score on turn 6, but 2-1 grind kind of means you need to score on turn 8 (or 7 if there is no credible one turn threat).
As to what happened at the end with a riot... well stuff happens and sometimes you can't predict it. It doesn't seem as though an MA8 AG3 guy should be able to one turn that often on you anyway. And if you just set up with everyone in the normal deep stagger to force lots of dodges then readjusting to defend the 2 turn shouldn't be that tricky, but it depends on numbers as well. |
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The_Great_Gobbo
Joined: Aug 04, 2014
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Apr 02, 2015 - 17:03 |
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Shraaaag
Joined: Feb 15, 2004
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Apr 02, 2015 - 17:05 |
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Don't let your opponent score quickly unless you plan on using the rest of the half stalling and grinding him down. |
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koadah
Joined: Mar 30, 2005
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Apr 02, 2015 - 17:27 |
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Angmarred
Joined: Feb 28, 2015
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| Posted:
Apr 02, 2015 - 17:39 |
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You misunderstand. I didn't purposefully allow either of the quick scores. He just outplayed me  |
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koadah
Joined: Mar 30, 2005
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Apr 02, 2015 - 18:11 |
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| Angmarred wrote: | | You misunderstand. I didn't purposefully allow either of the quick scores. He just outplayed me |
Ah. Apologies.
It is great to know that you are not yet old and cynical. 
Maybe you played some crap defense. The cynical old vets are maybe not really bothered because.
1. Letting him score early is not necessarily a bad thing. As long as you don't let him stall you can grind back down the field for 1-1 at the half.
2. You needed to delay your first half score to leave him zero or one turns. But that is a judgement call as to whether you can hold the stall. Some cynical dudes may wonder if he let you score.
3. The second half sounds as though you did well enough but got bitten by the kick off table. It happens.
Watch some replays or spec games of some of the top coaches and see how they do it.
See how they set up for kick off, how they pressure the ball, how they hold up the offence, how they hold a stall, how and when they attack the ball
e.t.c.
Edit: You did leave uncontested access to your back field for the that "easy two turner". That's why it was easy. He could run as many men as he liked down there without even having to throw a block. Then you were left trying to mark everyone up. It was a good bet that someone would get free.
Actually you could have moved more players to mark up before going for that blitz. 2D blocking his blitzers out of the way was less likely to fail than the GFI. Even so. 1/36 could still be considered bad luck. |
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Smeat
Joined: Nov 19, 2006
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Apr 02, 2015 - 22:22 |
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| Angmarred wrote: | | You misunderstand. I didn't purposefully allow either of the quick scores. He just outplayed me |
Well, I'm not sure there was much "play" involved in that first score - he just walked around you and into the endzone.
But more on that later...
First, as said above, Kicking off and then allowing/inviting/pressuring a fast score, so that you have ample time to tie, is a solid strategy if you have a team that can control the ball and stall in the 2nd half. Even if that fails, coming out of the 1st half tied and receiving in in your favor. The "standard 2:1 win" is called "standard" for a reason.
That said, you may not be confident or practiced enough in your team/abilites to rely on that - fair enough, it will come, use it once you feel more comfortable with it.
But, for now, let's assume you did want to stop him...
1) Defensive formation:
You used a classic "anti-foul/bash" central cluster (D1 on this page) - which allows both sides open. Which is fine ~IF~ your team has the skills to respond to cut them off - the MA plus either keeping your players un-marked and/OR the ability to dodge/Break Tackle to get out in front of the scoring threat.
And your Turn 1, you didn't get in front of him on the bottom, and you didn't keep your players back where they could not be tied up. You had committed half your weight up to his weak side, tied up away from the ball, and had only 1 Blocker on the side in front of the ball. So he marked all the bulls (and some others), brushed that token blocker aside (a Push would have been more than enough) and swung the majority of his team around that side, the ball behind them - done. You're lucky he didn't decide to stall (he ~should~ have!).
At a basic level, if you want to stop someone, you need players 2-deep in defense, one behind the other. The Offense can blitz the first, but not the second. If you repeat this formation staggered every 3 squares across the field in front of the offense, , you create a "stonewall" or "2-deep" defense - very tough to crack. (But you have to keep some players mobile!)
If, otoh, you 1) are not afraid of the bash/foul and/or b) don't want him to score quickly and/or iii) are facing a fast, passing team - then start with a Defensive Formation more like something in A or B on that page - something that keeps him from pushing up too freely to start with. This is what you wanted Turn 7. Try to keep at least 1 of your Bulls (if not both) safe from being marked (or with "help" who can block them free), so they can swing to either side to respond. (I'm thinkin' B1, w/ Bulls back on the nside, or B4, w/ Bulls 2nd from the outside, but ymmv.)
2) When you have the ball and are in control, don't panic.
You caged up well and had brought the bash - at the start of Turn 6, you were on the 9 and had the Ogre & 2 rookies out for a 3-player advantage. Almost half is team were in the bottom wide zone, screen by a bull and Blocker, and you had the ballcarrier and 4 others free to maneuver - you had position. And you threw that away and scored.
Many new coaches score the moment they can (even if higher risk than waiting a turn) - they feel they get the chance so seldom, they should grab it. Understandable, but - don't panic. Have faith, keep the ball secure in a cage, and build on your advantage.
I would have seen if I could Block a that diagonal gap wider, Blitz out to get the prone Bull free, and just move with support in that direction - you had 2 free Hobbos plus whatever you could block free.
Or - stay tight and in mutual support, and just cage up a bit in front once you saw who was down. 2 more Turns is a lot of time when you are up by 3 players and half of what's left of the opponent is on the ground. If they dodge away, they can only move MA-3, so even Dwarves can chase them, and they leave your players free to maneuver.
(Another trick is to sandwich the ball between 2 Guards:Any St 3 who tries to hit him becomes St 2 for -2D - not impossible, but also not inviting.)
Same thing Turn 3 of 2nd half - you had the advtange in Guards, in Strength, and in numbers (11:10) with LOTS of time - you should have just tightened up the formation, kept the cage working and been patient. Intead you sent a ballcarrier out without support - with predictable results. 
3) If there are multiple scoring threats, knock down the biggest (or easiest), and mob the rest.
Turn 16, you did some strange defensive half-screen that he simply ran around. Pointless. Just mark up with everyone, make the catch/blitz/dodge rolls as hard as you can on anyone scoring range, force him to roll as many (bad?) dice as possible, hope for the best.
All in all, your play was not bad - you made some 1d Blocks when you should have starte with 2d's, but you caged and advanced the ball decently (at least right up until you panicked), and you (should have) salvaged the tie. A better defensive setup when approp, and more faith in your offense when you have the advantage, will help a lot. |
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(...and what exactly do you think they do with all those dead players?...) |
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Angmarred
Joined: Feb 28, 2015
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| Posted:
Apr 03, 2015 - 11:04 |
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Thanks to everyone who replied, especially Smeat. I learned a ton |
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Smeat
Joined: Nov 19, 2006
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| Posted:
Apr 03, 2015 - 11:14 |
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I parrot from the best. |
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Let's go A.P.E.!
(...and what exactly do you think they do with all those dead players?...) |
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