mrt1212
Joined: Feb 26, 2013
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Jan 26, 2015 - 04:15 |
 
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Yeah, the thrower is kinda boo boo crew as the amount of times I've used Safe Throw is so few I can't even recall. On the other hand at least he isn't the norse thrower. |
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ahalfling
Joined: Aug 16, 2008
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Jan 26, 2015 - 05:09 |
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Norse thrower + leader saves you 20k, and on a team with no massively better carriers, you might as well give it to the thrower. Having a guy who can pass if you need it is not worth nothing. I wouldn't replace one unless I had 2 ulfs/berserkers/runners, but (Leader aside) if the skills of the guy who's 20k more only makes a difference every couple games, well, 20k is cheap.
The difference with elves -- and I'm saying this as a guy who likes elf throwers just fine -- is that they're worse in some ways at having the ball than their teammates. They can pass better, sure, but they're much slower than the catchers, and blitzers are somewhat faster and have block. That's a bigger difference than the one between Norse throwers and runners, and every elf team has a BUNCH of guys with those advantages.
(But doesn't it seem like the safe throw throwers and the NOS catchers should be on the same team? Each of the vanilla-elf teams has half of that puzzle. And it's not like it's a massively valuable combo to have, because you don't exactly see HE or PE teams scrambling to put it together, but it does fit together...) |
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the_Sage
Joined: Jan 13, 2011
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Jan 26, 2015 - 08:30 |
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I think it's nice that the high elves have the most throwery thrower, while the pro elves have the most catchery catchers. At least it sets them apart. You can still give NoS to catchers on doubles (but pretty much no-one does) or give safe throw to throwers on normals (but very few people do).
I like developed high elf throwers as retrievers; that one crunch turn where you pop the ball free and need to get it safe, having a helf thrower (with leap and sure hands) lets you pass over the opposition to some catcher who can then run off with the ball. But that view may be somewhat biased by me rolling +AG on all my high elf throwers. =D
(AND dark elf runners, really. Lucky git, me.) |
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bghandras
Joined: Feb 06, 2011
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Jan 26, 2015 - 09:24 |
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Good job. You convinced me that delves should have 2 blitzers, and helfs should have 4. |
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Roland
Joined: May 12, 2004
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Jan 26, 2015 - 09:34 |
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nah, just cut HE from the crp list.
They replaced PE once, right? and now we have the PE back anyway.
while we're at it, cut undead too, khemri and necro were going to replace them but undead are still around somehow... |
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Catalyst32
Joined: Jul 14, 2008
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Jan 26, 2015 - 09:45 |
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| ahalfling wrote: | Norse thrower + leader saves you 20k, and on a team with no massively better carriers, you might as well give it to the thrower. Having a guy who can pass if you need it is not worth nothing. I wouldn't replace one unless I had 2 ulfs/berserkers/runners, but (Leader aside) if the skills of the guy who's 20k more only makes a difference every couple games, well, 20k is cheap.
The difference with elves -- and I'm saying this as a guy who likes elf throwers just fine -- is that they're worse in some ways at having the ball than their teammates. They can pass better, sure, but they're much slower than the catchers, and blitzers are somewhat faster and have block. That's a bigger difference than the one between Norse throwers and runners, and every elf team has a BUNCH of guys with those advantages.
(But doesn't it seem like the safe throw throwers and the NOS catchers should be on the same team? Each of the vanilla-elf teams has half of that puzzle. And it's not like it's a massively valuable combo to have, because you don't exactly see HE or PE teams scrambling to put it together, but it does fit together...) |
Nice call on putting the NOS Catchers and Safe Throw Throwers on the same team. That does make some sense as a combo designed to make 1 Elf Roster the "#1 Passing Elves" in the game.
Those are skills most people do not take that would be good to have on the same team. Even I, someone who likes having them to start on the players they start on... even I don't pick those as skills on my team (except 1 time on a High Elf Catcher and I wish he took something else).
There have been some good suggestions made since last this thread was Necro'd.
I really like the idea of making High Elves the 0-4 Blitzers Elf team rather than Dark Elves. That would make HE the better "stand and fight" Elf team. The extra Blitzers in the roster would help make the team easier to recover WHEN they eventually get smashed.
I think they should also keep 0-4 Catchers... and the Thrower could LOSE Safe Throw (or not idk). That would up team speed and survivability.
Give the Pro Elf Thrower Safe Throw to help encourage making them the "Passing" elf team and maybe add something else to their Thrower OR Catchers. For the Catchers an additional skill like Diving Catch might be worth bringing into the game... maybe even at no additional cost (idk). Maybe the Thrower should also have NOS... these Elves will not be afraid of anything (at least not Tackle Zones).
For Dark Elves I like the idea of taking away 2 Blitzers. 0-2 Blitzers. Buff the Assassin AV to 8. Maybe even buff the Runner to AV8 or add useful skill at AV7. The Witch Elf is about right where she is.
I also think a Positional that FOULS would be in order for DEs. A player that starts with Dirty Player and/or Sneaky Git would be nice. Dark Elves should be fouling elves. The cheating elves with the daggers to the ribs and boots to the face all over.
OR maybe a player with Wrestle. Pulling opponents to the ground to Wrestle is the kind of rough and tumble sort of thing that could suggest that wicked identity for a team. Maybe they could even keep the 0-4 Blitzers if only you swapped out Block for Wrestle.
There is also some good synergy between Wrestle and Jump Up... the Witch has Jump Up and can take Wrestle. If the Blitzers all took Jump Up... 6 players then have it. That is a lot of Blocking from a Prone Position that could go on. I used to like all that Jump Up about Norse when they had 4 Blitzers/Berserkers and with it no longer being much a part of that roster it could come back with the DEs.
Anyway... I'm just tossing around ideas and enjoying a conversation. |
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Catalyst32
Joined: Jul 14, 2008
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Jan 26, 2015 - 10:24 |
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You know... now that I think of it... why couldn't Dark Elves get a Minotaur added to the roster. They had them in Dungeon Bowl. I would bet DE fans would LOVE to see a Minotaur run amock on the pitch ripping opponents players to shreds and creating general mayhem.
It would be a nice piece to combat the Skaven RatOgre or Slann Kroxigor or Human Ogre or Woody Treeman. It seems like the perfect "pet" for a team of wicked Elves to employ. (and you wouldn't have to buy him if you didn't want to.)
Just a thought. |
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Roland
Joined: May 12, 2004
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Jan 26, 2015 - 10:31 |
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| Catalyst32 wrote: | You know... now that I think of it... why couldn't Dark Elves get a Minotaur added to the roster. They had them in Dungeon Bowl. I would bet DE fans would LOVE to see a Minotaur run amock on the pitch ripping opponents players to shreds and creating general mayhem.
It would be a nice piece to combat the Skaven RatOgre or Slann Kroxigor or Human Ogre or Woody Treeman. It seems like the perfect "pet" for a team of wicked Elves to employ. (and you wouldn't have to buy him if you didn't want to.)
Just a thought. |
or a Cold One? 
or baby hydra  |
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tmoila
Joined: Nov 25, 2012
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Jan 26, 2015 - 10:32 |
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I think because elves with ST = too op. WE have treeman yes but treemans are like worst big guys.
Same goes to any idea about adding S -normal access to HE blitzers. |
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ahalfling
Joined: Aug 16, 2008
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Jan 26, 2015 - 10:44 |
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Eh. All it means is they get guard a little easier... and they'll still get beat against most teams in scrums, so it's still more a spot skill than the majority of the strategy. I guess mighty blow, if that's worth bothering with. The option to take SF instead of SS. But humans have four guys with S access, plus the ogre, and they don't beat anyone up without lucky rolls. If you roll doubles and get a few elves with guard, you don't suddenly become an unbeatable superteam. It just doesn't seem like a big deal to me, because elves don't have the capacity to become real bashers anyway, but maybe I'm wrong? |
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Beat Claw, Play AV7
(Hell, I ran a forward passing orc team back in the '90s. You probably shouldn't listen to me. Ever.) |
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Loew
Joined: Feb 02, 2005
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Jan 26, 2015 - 10:47 |
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| NerdBird wrote: | | I don't know if there is any other team that suffers such a fall off when they lose a few players. |
You should feel a lot of Lizardplayer angrily glaring at you right now 
But among elves, yep, you are right. |
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bghandras
Joined: Feb 06, 2011
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Jan 26, 2015 - 11:02 |
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S access to elf blitzers mean access to POMB. I would build 1 pomber, and rest guard. If there are 2 blitzers only, then not a big issue. It would with 4 I think. |
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Roland
Joined: May 12, 2004
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Jan 26, 2015 - 11:09 |
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| bghandras wrote: | | S access to elf blitzers mean access to POMB. I would build 1 pomber, and rest guard. If there are 2 blitzers only, then not a big issue. It would with 4 I think. |
don't forget jump up, if they´re GAS that is... |
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Mr_Foulscumm
Joined: Mar 05, 2005
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Jan 26, 2015 - 11:30 |
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Elves need a boost. Clearly they're some of the weakest teams, and don't win enough with these substandard rosters. |
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Everybody's favorite coach on FUMBBL |
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Coma
Joined: Sep 15, 2011
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Jan 26, 2015 - 12:17 |
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Love the mino on DE idea and have supported that my self for a while now  . Also make assassins 0-1, AV8 and dirty player with the same cost.
HE is a really cool team but for me is lacking (as almost everyone already mentioned) important starting skills. I would like blitzers to have PRO at the start and make the thrower MA7 (that would make him both a runner and a thrower piece). |
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