| Poll |
| Thoughts on the Pump Wagon... |
| Leave it alone! |
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37% |
[ 18 ] |
| Remove No Hands, add Extra Arms |
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60% |
[ 29 ] |
| Remove No Hands, AG2 |
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2% |
[ 1 ] |
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| Total Votes : 48 |
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gjopie
Joined: Oct 27, 2009
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 Posted:
Mar 06, 2015 - 17:32 |
 
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| m0gw41 wrote: | Sounds a fun idea but have you ever tried picking up a ball or throwing accurately from a moving vehicle? I think stick with ag1 and extra arms for a 50:50 pick up/catch. There is no loner so that's not bad if you want to use a rr to get the ball on board. I think stick with ag1 as don't think little stunties should be able to throw the ball or bombs better than when they are on the floor, I can't imagine the wagon would be a smooth ride!!
This will have to be play tested though as teams without a big guy are going to struggle to bring the cart down without weaponry or a -3db. |
True, but these things move at MA4 (and a failed GFI sees them off the pitch), and more to the point, move erratically - if you get near the edge of the pitch, you may need to give up movement to get closer to the centre. Plus it will be almost impossible to cage with them.
I don't think they make ideal ball-carriers by any stretch of the imagination. When you can get it to them (on a 4+), there is no guarantee they will ever make it to the endzone, with or without opponents getting in the way! |
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m0gw41
Joined: Jun 12, 2012
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| Posted:
Mar 06, 2015 - 17:49 |
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I still think it would be possibly too good against some teams. If they only move forward then they will be in the endzone from the LoS in 3 turns with a GFI (that can be rerolled), or 4 with a safety margin in the unlikely case that they roll 7 times towards one sideline with no correction from the other side (someone else can work out the odds of that!!)
I know that's also alot of blocking dice to roll but with proper snot positioning (hell you can push them along with you to help as well) in most cases that is going to be four 3dbs max with a 1.3% failure rate with a rr.
It would be a laugh to even see it tested! |
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gjopie
Joined: Oct 27, 2009
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| Posted:
Mar 06, 2015 - 17:56 |
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| m0gw41 wrote: | I still think it would be possibly too good against some teams. If they only move forward then they will be in the endzone from the LoS in 3 turns with a GFI (that can be rerolled), or 4 with a safety margin in the unlikely case that they roll 7 times towards one sideline with no correction from the other side (someone else can work out the odds of that!!)
I know that's also alot of blocking dice to roll but with proper snot positioning (hell you can push them along with you to help as well) in most cases that is going to be four 3dbs max with a 1.3% failure rate with a rr. |
It's not so much the blocking dice, but the fact that travelling at that pace would leave them very exposed if you can't get snotlings around them to protect them. A regular stunty would need 1 assist to get a -2db block on them - and they will very rarely have block, dodge or sure hands (so 25% chance of getting them down without RR - 43.75% with - which goes up to 70%/91% for strip ballers).
But you're right, it would need to be tested for balance. I think most teams would have something to combat them, though, and the rest of the snots are pretty useless. Maybe it would need to be combined with lowering the ejection roll to 5+.
| Quote: | | It would be a laugh to even see it tested! |
Definitely agree! |
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m0gw41
Joined: Jun 12, 2012
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| Posted:
Mar 06, 2015 - 18:00 |
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Well you should be able to dodge some snots into help quite easily (2+ with dodge). They might get smacked about a bit on the way but with sidestep they will be annoying enough and make it harder to get that assist. Guard on the wagon would help with that and a guard troll hopefully can help too.
Either way who do we need to pay to see this in action?!  |
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gjopie
Joined: Oct 27, 2009
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| Posted:
Mar 06, 2015 - 18:02 |
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| m0gw41 wrote: | | Either way who do we need to pay to see this in action?! |
If I wasn't at work I would give it a go with the "test:" function of the client. If nobody else has done it by the time I'm home, maybe I'll try it out. |
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Sigmar1
Joined: Aug 13, 2008
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| Posted:
Mar 06, 2015 - 18:04 |
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The possibility of a BnC ball carrier is one of the cooler ideas I've seen floated in a while. Not only would it give Snots an additional 'schtick' but also give them another fun tactic to try.
AG1, extra arms, NOS makes perfect sense to me. It's not that the Snots have 'steely nerves', it's that opposing players surrounding the massive Pump Wagon simply have no way of interfering with what the Snot holding the ball is going to try an do with the ball. The AG1 perfectly represents the difficulty of doing anything with the ball (or bomb should one be caught), and the extra arms makes sense as well.
As for other teams stopping it...any team with a big already has an option. The 'no-big' teams all have either Stabbers (Eshin, Skink, FGob) Dauntless (Gnomes), or Bombs (Gnomes, Cheaters, Eshin). I seem to recall Wagons used to be AV6 whereas now they're AV9. Adding the ball-handling tactic may require reducing their AV to 7 or 8 to give Stabbers a reasonable chance.
+1 on the snotling MOB icon. |
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mister__joshua
Joined: Jun 20, 2007
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| WhatBall wrote: | | Can someone test removing No Hands and see what happens when it catches a bomb? If you could do that and let me know, I would appreciate it. |
Just tested it in a game. On it's turn the Wagon can't perform any actions but move, so once you give it the ball it's stuck there (which is cool, and as you'd expect)
If you throw a bomb at it and it catches it then it can throw it again as normal, as it's not it's turn and the action is automatic.
So in short, it seems to work fine
edit: also I'd be up for a handed (the opposite of no hands?) wagon test game sometime, but not right now  |
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ahalfling
Joined: Aug 16, 2008
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| Posted:
Mar 06, 2015 - 21:50 |
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I mean, the splatta wagon probably needs work, right? Most teams don't take it, and the few times I HAVE seen it it lasts a turn at most. |
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WhatBall
Joined: Aug 21, 2008
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| Posted:
Mar 06, 2015 - 22:31 |
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| ahalfling wrote: | | I mean, the splatta wagon probably needs work, right? Most teams don't take it, and the few times I HAVE seen it it lasts a turn at most. |
I take it. It has great range and has G access. If you can Blockle it up and use it right, it can be devastating. |
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gjopie
Joined: Oct 27, 2009
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| Posted:
Mar 07, 2015 - 12:14 |
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| ahalfling wrote: | | I mean, the splatta wagon probably needs work, right? Most teams don't take it, and the few times I HAVE seen it it lasts a turn at most. |
Why on earth would people not take it? Does anyone seriously do that?
It's far better than the alternative (a snotling)! And if you're worrying about min-maxing, you are definitely playing stunty wrong. |
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mister__joshua
Joined: Jun 20, 2007
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I haven't player Snots yet (though plan to soon) and I can't see a reason not to take it.
Looking at the roster I'm also not a massive fan of the Snotling Goon. He's not a bad player, but it feels like a bit of an excuse to squeeze some G access in there. It also seems weird that a mob of Snotlings would have the same statline as a single snotling. I feel the same way about the Gnoblar bully. Not a stat change, couldn't they be called Snotling Hit Squad or Posse or Gang or something (bigger than a mob) and have an icon of more snots than the mob so it makes sense. They could use the same profile as the Mob (gaining regen and 2 heads, losing titchy) but would soon have DP. I think it's more of a fluff justification I'm looking for really. Maybe others feel differently and like it as it is.
If they were looking for a change, they could maybe have Guard or Dauntless to represent ganging up, but equally I think they'd work well just as they are. |
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WhatBall
Joined: Aug 21, 2008
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| Posted:
Mar 07, 2015 - 18:05 |
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Not looking to change the Snots themselves. More later... |
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mister__joshua
Joined: Jun 20, 2007
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| WhatBall wrote: | | Not looking to change the Snots themselves. More later... |
That's fair enough. I didn't think you'd want more than 1 change at a time. What I'm suggesting is more of a name and icon theme change than a stat one.
I made these quickly as an example (from the existing snot icons)
Snotling Mob: 
Snotling Hit Squad: 
The hit squad looks a bit harder, and is essentially a larger group of snots. This would replace the Goon. If you wanted to bring their stats in line with the normal snots later on then that's an option, but you could easily say that their more gifted ability makes them harder to replace thus no regen. It just seemed off that the group of snots is less hard than the single snot. It would make more sense the other way around, but then your base snots wouldn't regen (assuming the titchy > 2-heads regen change is to represent the group over the individual).
Just an idea |
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WhatBall
Joined: Aug 21, 2008
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| Posted:
Mar 07, 2015 - 19:43 |
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I really don't want group icons, they look tougher than ST1, especially with other Stunty icons.
The "mob" is all of the Snotlings on the team, plus others who accidentally join. The idea is that there are more than the 16 man roster allows, so there are always extra spares, versus a mob being a group of Snots as a sinlge player.
From the Handbook:
Snotling Mob
Being so small and difficult to count, Snotlings are often able to field more than the legal maximum of eleven players per side. This is likely unintentional, but with no one on the team able to count above three and random Snotling fans wandering onto the pitch from the stands it is impossible to keep track of them. As such, no matter how many Snotlings their competitors injure, another one seems to replace them.
The Goons are designed to give the team a bit of help if you can skill them with Blockle. here is their description:
Snotling Goon
Even the weakest races have their bullies. Being endowed with strength and ability slightly above useless, the Snotling Goons are able to enforce their will onto the rest of their race. On the pitch they are too stupid to realize this superiority doesn’t extend to any other players, bar the occasional Brownie. |
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WhatBall
Joined: Aug 21, 2008
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| Posted:
Mar 07, 2015 - 19:49 |
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I added a poll.
The poll ate my fourth option. 
4. Fill the Pump Wagon with PIE, sell them during the game to offset the losses you are going to incur by playing Snotlings. |
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Gnomes are trash
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