| Poll |
| Goal: Horned/dauntless gutter...which take first? |
| Dauntless |
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84% |
[ 78 ] |
| Horns |
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15% |
[ 14 ] |
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| Total Votes : 92 |
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AFK_Eagle
Joined: Mar 12, 2004
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 Posted:
Apr 28, 2005 - 16:37 |
 
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This is not so much a question I wish to have answered, as trying to start a conversation. Skaven coach, gutter runner rolls a double, want to make him into an uber-blitzer. The obvious two skills needed are dauntless (so you can take on anybody) and horns (so after you take them on, you get that one extra bit of umph to be better than them).
Which to take first?
I've seen a number of people (most, actually) take dauntless first, probably under the idea that they can take on str 4+ guys right away with only a single assist for that 2d block. Personally, I always go horns first. Yes, it means I'm not as proficient against the higher strength players, but in my experience the ball handlers are going to be str 3 characters 9 times out of 10, barring +str skills. Thus, by going horns first, I get an automatic +1 str enhancement, giving me str 3, and with one assist I get an automatic 2d block on your standard str 3 defender. Compare that to dauntless, which you still have to roll the dauntless roll, and believe me, I've failed vs str 3 more often than I care to admit.
So, skaven coaches, which do you take first? Dauntless, for more risk but more versatility? Horns, for the safety of being automatic (esp vs elven/human catchers), but more work vs higher str? |
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Listen to Eagle! Eagle is good, Eagle is wise!
Founder of the E.L.F.--These elves will play anybody! |
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JanMattys
Joined: Feb 29, 2004
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| Posted:
Apr 28, 2005 - 16:45 |
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Dauntless all the way. It's not about the reliability... it's about the fact that you can use it in more than one situation. ST4 guys are untouched by a horned runner, while dauntless is very useful. |
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Britnoth
Joined: Aug 02, 2003
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| Posted:
Apr 28, 2005 - 16:49 |
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Failure on a str 3 dauntless roll is only 1 in 12, so getting horns instead is a big mistake. |
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RandomOracle
Joined: Jan 11, 2004
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| Posted:
Apr 28, 2005 - 17:01 |
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Dauntless first, as you can use it not only when blitzing but also when blocking. |
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Optihut
Joined: Dec 16, 2004
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| Posted:
Apr 28, 2005 - 17:40 |
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You can also use dauntless on a simple block, whereas you need to blitz to make use of horns. Hence, I'm voting for dauntless as well.
EDIT: Hmmm, the previous poster already mentioned that 40 minutes ago... I really should pay more attention... |
Last edited by Optihut on %b %09, %2005 - %18:%May; edited 1 time in total |
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origami
Joined: Oct 14, 2003
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| Posted:
Apr 28, 2005 - 20:27 |
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Dauntless is useful in far more situations. It works on both blitzes and blocks. It allows you to hit +ST ball carriers. Against st3 players it is also quite reliable. |
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AFK_Eagle
Joined: Mar 12, 2004
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| Posted:
Apr 28, 2005 - 20:39 |
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There you have it, any noobs reading this forum for tactical ideas, the collective experience of several thousand games of bloodbowl in these replies. Take their advice for what it's worth... |
_________________
Listen to Eagle! Eagle is good, Eagle is wise!
Founder of the E.L.F.--These elves will play anybody! |
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tza
Joined: Aug 25, 2004
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| Posted:
Apr 28, 2005 - 21:01 |
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The odd 'pro' of getting horns before dauntless that nobody here has really touched..
Is the ST2 catchers out there. There's plenty of them. They have the ball alot. And dauntless is void against them unless you got yourself a ST1 GR. In that case, Horns is the better choise as it will give you 2 dice from your now superior strenght of the blitz.
That said, I go with dauntless before horns on a ST2 GR. |
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Alanir
Joined: Aug 02, 2003
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| Posted:
Apr 28, 2005 - 21:31 |
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I've thought about it, and I'm gonna take horns if I get dbls on a gutter, as that makes him great for blitzing str 2 catchers and a 100% chance of being str 3. It's not hard at all for skaven to get an assist with another gutter runner early on, and other teams aren't going to be as built up with str 4 guys. Granted, if all you're gonna play against is orcs chaos and khemri, and you're planning on using your gutter runner to block all of the time, maybe you'd go for dauntless first. But you've got so much time to get that runner another double for dauntless that it shouldn't matter. If you're that concerned about it, take one with horns first then one with dauntless. |
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Shintyboy
Joined: Jan 29, 2005
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| Posted:
May 01, 2005 - 01:44 |
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I would say that the skills are pretty evenly matched but dauntless has the edge for me is that it can get you out of a jam against teams with a lot of st 4 players like orcs or chaos |
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meanandgreen
Joined: Mar 21, 2004
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| Posted:
May 09, 2005 - 17:15 |
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| Britnoth wrote: | | Failure on a str 3 dauntless roll is only 1 in 12, so getting horns instead is a big mistake. |
please expain, this doesn't make sense 
if no re-roll it's 1/6, if re-roll then 1/36 (1/6×1/6), if pro uhm  ...
1/6 ×1/2×1/6)=1/18, considered you don't use re-roll on pro
else it's 1/6×3/4×1/6=3/144=1/48
so why is it 1 in 12? |
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Arktoris
Joined: Feb 16, 2004
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| Posted:
May 09, 2005 - 17:21 |
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there are 36 combinations of rolls on 2d6
only a 2 or 3 will fail a dauntless roll against 3str
so the following dice combinations fail:
1,1
1,2
2,1
that's 3/36 chance for failure....reduce fraction to 1/12 |
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Malerun
Joined: Dec 03, 2003
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| Posted:
May 09, 2005 - 17:25 |
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3 times out of 36 it fails (1,1), (1,2) and (2,1), thus 1/12
You seem able to figure out the reroll thing yourself 
Malerun |
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JanMattys
Joined: Feb 29, 2004
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| Posted:
May 09, 2005 - 17:26 |
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| meanandgreen wrote: | | Britnoth wrote: | | Failure on a str 3 dauntless roll is only 1 in 12, so getting horns instead is a big mistake. |
please expain, this doesn't make sense
if no re-roll it's 1/6, if re-roll then 1/36 (1/6×1/6), if pro uhm ...
1/6 ×1/2×1/6)=1/18, considered you don't use re-roll on pro
else it's 1/6×3/4×1/6=3/144=1/48
so why is it 1 in 12? |
Actually, meanandgreen, failure on a STR 3 dauntless roll is 3/36 without reroll, exactly 1/12.
1/144 with reroll.
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