Lyracian
Joined: Oct 29, 2015
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 Posted:
Dec 08, 2020 - 17:02 |
 
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Diving Catch got better this edition too. Two players can both try and catch the ball. In fact a player from both teams can try, and success, on catching the ball!
I can see nothing in the rules about who has priority to catch the ball when both teams have players able to do so... |
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Nuffle wills it.
Lyracian. |
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neubau
Joined: Nov 12, 2016
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Dec 08, 2020 - 19:46 |
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| Quote: | Q: When making a Passing Ability test, if the roll is not a
natural 1, but is reduced to less than 1 after modifiers have
been applied, is this an inaccurate pass or a wildly inaccurate
pass? (p.49)
A: This will be a wildly inaccurate pass. |
well. |
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CAB
Joined: Aug 02, 2003
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Dec 08, 2020 - 20:22 |
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Yep... this was pretty much already confirmed from the video they released. The FAQ also mention that a PA 1+ means that a modified "1" is Accurate and not Wildly Inaccurate.
Unrelated to passing... but it also is confirmed that you can now use multiple re-rolls per turn if you like. So that is a pretty big change.  |
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Lyracian
Joined: Oct 29, 2015
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Dec 08, 2020 - 20:41 |
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It is amusing that "Modified 1" and "Modified 1 or less" is FAQ not errata!
The Designer’s Commentary answers a series of questions posed to the rules team. These are presented in a question and answer format, and they help settle any debates around specific rules.**
** You’re certainly still welcome to duke it out on the pitch in time-honoured Blood Bowl tradition.
I guess we can carry on debating it in traditional forum method then.
At least PA 1+ is useful now. More useful that Accurate/Cannoneer as it works at all ranges and has the same TV cost, but higher SPP cost.
Sure Feet is likely going to be a better passing skill than most of the Passing skills anyway... |
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MattDakka
Joined: Oct 09, 2007
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Dec 08, 2020 - 20:47 |
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| Lyracian wrote: | | Sure Feet is likely going to be a better passing skill than most of the Passing skills anyway... |
And Sprint.  |
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CAB
Joined: Aug 02, 2003
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Dec 08, 2020 - 21:11 |
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Passing is still important if you need to use both a pass and a handover in the same turn though. Some teams tend to do this more than others. It's not that unreasonable for Elven teams to pull those of late in a drive to faint from one side of the pitch to the other. |
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Lyracian
Joined: Oct 29, 2015
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Dec 08, 2020 - 22:01 |
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| CAB wrote: | | Passing is still important if you need to use both a pass and a handover in the same turn though. |
Sure that is when you a Quick Pass, or Pass as it will be called in the future. If you are really pushed you might risk the 1/18 on a Short Pass.
Longer passes are only done on Turn 8.
Standard Thrower with MA 6 double rush and a quick pass moves the ball 11 squares. The next MA 6 player moves it 9, when you include the hand off square. The third player scores. It is just a question of positioning.
When we had the preview and Wild appeared to be a 1/6 result that Throwers could easily cancel with a single skill it looked like a good change to promote a weak positional.
Now anything more than a quick pass is a desperation play. When we look at the results any long bomb on a starting player is 50% Wild!
As for Passing skills. Leader is still good Season 1 however I am not sure it will be worth the opportunity cost of redrafting that player again. It does give you a slight reduction in TV compared to buying a TRR but I do not think we will be able to keep the player resulting in us having to spent SPP every season to get the skill.
"On the Ball" is the only skill I am thinking of for a regular team and then "Hail Mary" for Goblins. |
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MattDakka
Joined: Oct 09, 2007
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Dec 08, 2020 - 22:34 |
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| Lyracian wrote: |
Now anything more than a quick pass is a desperation play. When we look at the results any long bomb on a starting player is 50% Wild!
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Long Bomb
PA 6+: WI 50%, I 16.66%, A 16.66%
PA 5+: WI 50%, I 16.66%, A 16.66%
PA 4+: WI 50%, I 16.66%, A 16.66%
PA 3+: WI 50%, I 16.66%, A 16.66%
PA 2+: WI 50&, I 0%, A 33.33%
Yes, amongst starting players, only PA 2+ has 33.33% Accurate chance. |
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WhatBall
Joined: Aug 21, 2008
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| Posted:
Dec 08, 2020 - 23:35 |
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| MattDakka wrote: | | Lyracian wrote: |
Now anything more than a quick pass is a desperation play. When we look at the results any long bomb on a starting player is 50% Wild!
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Long Bomb
PA 6+: WI 50%, I 16.66%, A 16.66%
PA 5+: WI 50%, I 16.66%, A 16.66%
PA 4+: WI 50%, I 16.66%, A 16.66%
PA 3+: WI 50%, I 16.66%, A 16.66%
PA 2+: WI 50&, I 0%, A 33.33%
Yes, amongst starting players, only PA 2+ has 33.33% Accurate chance. |
From a game design (and logic) perspective this chart breaks my soul. |
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Felix17
Joined: May 23, 2019
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Dec 08, 2020 - 23:54 |
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Another thing is, I think that to make a Thrower viable for more than Quick Passes, you need several skills (stats like MA/PA, Cannoneer, NoS), but that takes time and 15 games later, bam, redraft to the pathetically low level of 1,350 and the thrower is 20k more I believe. Who is going to invest the time and SPP to a marginal player at low levels when more useful Blitzers and Catchers are standing by wanting their own development?
Looking forward to trying the new rules and hoping like he’ll that I’ve got this all wrong. |
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CAB
Joined: Aug 02, 2003
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Dec 08, 2020 - 23:55 |
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Personally I don't find it bad to pick one or two passing skills on your throwers in a League setting where you have a bit more incentive to score more quickly both to get more cash, SPP and more league points, a good thrower might be handy for some teams.
Dump Off is not a terrible skill either for most throwers that start with the Pass skill.
In a league setting you don't have to manage your Team Value in the same way that you need in a match making environment. It also depend on the types of teams you are up against as well.
So I don't think it is all gloom and doom, just because.
I'm sure the designers must have some reasoning for introducing the Wildly Inaccurate pass result into the game and we can only guess what it is. My guess is that they thought it would make plays in the last turn using passing longer than a quick pass a bigger risk for the attacking team... giving some incentive to pass one turn earlier or not at all and "risk" running the ball instead. If you get a WIP in turn 8 and the opponent have one turn left that could mean they score on you instead and that is really bad.
Another change is when a player is marked and tries to throw the ball in desperation and you are now quite likely to just throw the ball in a random direction instead and do so more often than you would fumble the ball before. The effect they are after might simply be that if you loose control of the ball it will be a bit harder to get control back and you will have to rely on consolidation more which might prevent a quick turn over.
It also have the effect that a player with a bad passing stat will get the ball away from a scrum rather than fumble the ball... this actually might be more akin to pushing a player on to the ball and see if it scatters to a better place, even if it causes a turn over.
I'm just trying to find some reasoning behind this new change, not saying that I agree to it in it's entirety. What I do say is that we probably need some experience before making a final judgement on how it will all turn out.
For a Human team thrower I could see myself picking Leader and then saving up 20SPP for a stat boost... if I get +MA I make him into a runner if I get +PA I make him into a long range thrower. I obviously will rehire this team captain for one or more seasons before training up another one to replace him. |
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ClayInfinity
Joined: Aug 15, 2003
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Dec 09, 2020 - 00:27 |
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| CAB wrote: |
In a league setting you don't have to manage your Team Value in the same way that you need in a match making environment. It also depend on the types of teams you are up against as well.
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You don't have to. Nobody has to do anything, but you should. |
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MattDakka
Joined: Oct 09, 2007
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Dec 09, 2020 - 00:32 |
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You don't manage the TV in private league if you don't care about playing vs a Wizard or other inducements.
If you play Khemri with a bloaty roster and your opponent has Skaven or Elves + a Wizard, you trim your TV before facing him, if you want to win. |
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CAB
Joined: Aug 02, 2003
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Dec 09, 2020 - 01:08 |
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| MattDakka wrote: | You don't manage the TV in private league if you don't care about playing vs a Wizard or other inducements.
If you play Khemri with a bloaty roster and your opponent has Skaven or Elves + a Wizard, you trim your TV before facing him, if you want to win. |
While I agree that you don't want to bloat the team unnecessarily I have never found that being ahead in a league is not almost always beneficial with having more skills rather than a Wizard, at least at low team value games... like up to about 1500 TV at least. The higher the TV of team the more power some inducement will have like the Wizard.
In League play if you are a bit more concerned about scoring then the Wizard is not so detrimental and a threat. If you don't try to score in the last turn in every offensive drive it can be difficult to get a good use of the Wizard.
In general I rarely am scared about the Wizard and frankly I rarely use the wizard myself unless I have shit load of petty cash. I probably favour stuff like Bribes, Babes and the odd mercenary more. I find them more tactically useful for the most part. Wizards also work better in some teams than others. I think Elves in general benefit more from the Wizard than say Orcs.
I don't view a couple of skills to be any problem what so ever on a team that are situational. Even situational skills will be very valuable at times. I could choose Block skill on my thrower, but that will give me incentive to use him as a blocker and I don't need every player on the team to act in that capacity. |
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koadah
Joined: Mar 30, 2005
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| Posted:
Dec 09, 2020 - 01:13 |
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