humppatoukka
Joined: Jan 03, 2010
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 Posted:
Dec 04, 2010 - 17:56 |
 
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Right.
Introducing my self, you can skip the first 2 paragraphs if not intrested.
I'm a fairly new coach, having played near 50 games I have begun to crasp the game mechanics and the basic strategies. As I'm a conservative and a teamdevelopment oriented player a bashy, high AV team would have been a natural choice for me. However I felt that playing a simple bashing game would be too straightforward I decided against starting a bashing team. After glancing through the team roosters I ended up with humans because of their versatility. I was sure that they would force me to learn new techniques and adopt different strategies depending on the situation.
And challenge was what I got.
After discussing the significance of an ogre in human team in another thread I realize that I've made a mistake overlooking it. Now my human team is in a pinch - nine players (only 2 blitzers!), 110k cash and a skilled lino with 2 niggles missing a game. I realize that that lino's gotta go, im keeping him for one match maxium to minimize games with an incomplete team.
After using my hardearned saving on a new blitzer im still 1 player short. Where did I go wrong?
To the point! On the hindsight I overloked the ogre and instead of buying 13th and/or 14th player bought a 4th reroll. That spells out as me using one more reroll on a critical (=risky) situation and more likely ending up with opponent having numerical superiority. This leads to humans (or mine) biggest weakness: Bashy opponents.
I have succesfully outbashed dwarves and chaos with humans, but this is marginal and has been due gainin superiority through succesful crowdpushes. My tactics have evolved around making sacrifices for keeping initiative and at the same time trying to seize opportunities to send players crowdsurfing or too far from action. At the worst of times I find my self trying to desperatly block back or dodge against a bashy team. Even with 4 guard blitzers and an ogre 2 dice blocks are not easy to come by, especially if opponent has started removing your players from the pitch.
Yes I know humans have potential and yes I know this subject isn't a new one, I found no threads satisfying my needs however.
What I'm intrested in is how to succesfully manage the human teams players and economy, and balance between potentially dead skills like "Tackle" vs allrounders such as "Pro" that are potentially used more often (tackle is hardly needed against humans archenemy - bashy teams). |
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Alf115
Joined: Aug 17, 2005
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Dec 04, 2010 - 17:59 |
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You can already scratch "Pro" out of your list of useful skills to start with. |
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humppatoukka
Joined: Jan 03, 2010
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Dec 04, 2010 - 18:08 |
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| Alf115 wrote: | | You can already scratch "Pro" out of your list of useful skills to start with. |
I was a bit misleading. Ment that in a case where, for example, a blitzer aldready has guard and MB. |
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zakatan
Joined: May 17, 2008
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Dec 04, 2010 - 18:21 |
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you do need tackle, even as a first skill. Humans are decent at everything and not good at anything, so actually, any specialist team is their arch-enemy. Elves will dance around you if you focus too much in the bashy part. I like to have a dedicated blitzer with tackle and mighty blow, in this order, and build the other blitzers with guard first.
rooster
roster |
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zakatan
Joined: May 17, 2008
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Dec 04, 2010 - 18:24 |
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retire the kicker to go one step down in the winnings table (+10k next game) and get a blitzer |
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Garion
Joined: Aug 19, 2009
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Dec 04, 2010 - 18:40 |
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| humppatoukka wrote: | ... a skilled lino with 2 niggles missing a game. I realize that that lino's gotta go, im keeping him for one match maxium to minimize games with an incomplete team.
After using my hardearned saving on a new blitzer im still 1 player short. Where did I go wrong?
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First of all, get rid of that lino now, there is no point in keeping him around. A journeyman would serve you better.
Also you just don't need pro on any of your human players period. It is a waste of a skill choice. The only player i would consider giving it too is the ogre but even then there aer far more useful skills for him to pick first. On singles - Guard, Pilling on, Multiblock, Break tackle, Standfirm, juggernaught, are all really good options. On doubles - block, tackle and dodge.
Against bashy opponents your humans will always have a hard time if you are trying to out bash them. You need to use your MA advantage to get you in to a scoring position and then start running down the clock. Your cacthers and blitzers are key here.
If too many of your players are being tied up by opponent players and it is forcing you to make too many dodges, then it sounds like you are leaving your defensive line to thin instead of adoptinig a more zonal defensive with at least two rows in your wall. I recommend you watch some of this teams games if you want to learn how to zonal defend well. -
http://fumbbl.com/FUMBBL.php?page=team&op=view&team_id=572760
That team is an all zombie team that has performed very well considering and they adopt the exact sort of zonal defending I am refering to.
Another tactic you need to employ is chosing your blitz more carefully. You do not haev to go for the biggest threat every turn, instead work out how you can free as many players up in your turn by making as few 2 dice block rolls as possible and preferable no 3+ dodge rolls. If you are still left with playes in tackle zones and you want to dodge them to safety make sure you do this last - do all other safer actions first.
You do need tackle. Stripball and wrestle is also a good combo for a lino to have. Also get some dirty players on your team so you can try and foul key targets out the game when an oppertunity arises. Sepcifically the block, Mighty Blow, Pile On Players. If a pile on player is lying on the ground surrounded by your players he is asking to be stamped on. |
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Macavity
Joined: Nov 23, 2004
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Dec 04, 2010 - 19:08 |
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Block and Tackle are my standard first two for linos, (not that I'm the most successful), Kick is a thrower skill for humans, in my mind. Remember that your main advantage over most teams is movement. Your BLitzers are blitzers, not blockers, at MV 7 they can and should charge the backfield/ballcarrier solo often. Guard is not key for this at all. Tackle, MB, maybe even strip ball will play more to the team's strength. Save bashing for against woodelves and skaven (where tackle can make a HUGE difference) |
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When I became a man I put away childish things, including the fear of childishness and the desire to be very grown up. -C.S. Lewis |
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Garion
Joined: Aug 19, 2009
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Dec 04, 2010 - 19:12 |
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I have just seen your team is playing in R which is the old ruleset so ignore my previous comments about using wrestle and any other CRP specific stuff I included. But the rest is true. |
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zakatan
Joined: May 17, 2008
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Dec 04, 2010 - 19:13 |
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garion, its a R team, no journeymen, jo juggernauts, etc |
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Frankenstein
Joined: Aug 02, 2003
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Dec 04, 2010 - 19:54 |
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| humppatoukka wrote: | | Alf115 wrote: | | You can already scratch "Pro" out of your list of useful skills to start with. |
I was a bit misleading. Ment that in a case where, for example, a blitzer aldready has guard and MB. |
Then it is still a horrible choice. |
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pythrr
Joined: Mar 07, 2006
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Dec 04, 2010 - 20:01 |
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| Frankenstein wrote: | | humppatoukka wrote: | | Alf115 wrote: | | You can already scratch "Pro" out of your list of useful skills to start with. |
I was a bit misleading. Ment that in a case where, for example, a blitzer aldready has guard and MB. |
Then it is still a horrible choice. |
+1. a stupid skill that just gets one into trouble. |
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RC
Joined: Sep 22, 2005
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Dec 04, 2010 - 20:18 |
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You might wanna consider not having a thrower and get sure hands to a lino or catcher that gets ag+. Also what most people don't realise is that you have to do a lot of dodges with your linos if you dont want them dead this doesn't mean that you should give them dodge on doubbles, give them guard  . Never leave a lino to be blocked by mb, just dodge him away and don't rr the failed dodge unless you have plenty of rrs.
In lrb4 the concept of fouling is important, so make sure that you get key fouls with 2 or 3 assists on annoying players. Wds, wolfes, ghouls, claw players, gutters ect. Humans are very good at fouling |
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"Oh, you hate your job? Why didn't you say so? There's a support group for that. It's called EVERYBODY, and they meet at the bar." |
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LykeX
Joined: Nov 26, 2006
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Dec 04, 2010 - 21:20 |
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| Frankenstein wrote: | | humppatoukka wrote: | | Alf115 wrote: | | You can already scratch "Pro" out of your list of useful skills to start with. |
I was a bit misleading. Ment that in a case where, for example, a blitzer already has guard and MB. |
Then it is still a horrible choice. |
Indeed. Any blitzer that already has MB will be well advised to take tackle as a next skill. Don't just knock those dodgers down; make sure they stay down.
I wonder, did you start with 4 blitzers? You should. They're the backbone of your team. |
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harvestmouse
Joined: May 13, 2007
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Dec 05, 2010 - 04:22 |
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Cant really see a reason why you would have pro on a human team, but not impossible.
For instance if somehow you had a standfirm mighty blow blitzer and rolled a normal, it wouldnt be a terrible choice. However I dont think id be taking it on the fellah until at least 4th skill. |
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Frankenstein
Joined: Aug 02, 2003
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Dec 05, 2010 - 11:14 |
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| harvestmouse wrote: | Cant really see a reason why you would have pro on a human team, but not impossible.
For instance if somehow you had a standfirm mighty blow blitzer and rolled a normal, it wouldnt be a terrible choice. |
No, it would still be a terrible pick as Guard is like 10 zillion times better in that case.
Pro only really makes sense on big guys and players who have run out of decent skill choices (e.g. 3rd normal pick for a linedwarf). |
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