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smeborg



Joined: Jan 04, 2019

Post   Posted: Oct 23, 2021 - 11:39 Reply with quote Back to top

I played a couple of games with my Imperial team s.nobs https://fumbbl.com/p/team?team_id=1051203 this morning (NZ time = server evenings). The choice was several Orc teams, several Dwarf teams, a couple of Chaos Dwarf teams, 1 Necro team, 1 Black Orc team, and 1 Human team which appeared fleetingly and was gone. No AG teams, no Stunty teams, no ST3 teams other than the Necros and Humies.

I believe in accepting challenges (everyone wants to play, right?), so played first against Dwarfs, then against Orcs.

I played a 3rd game this evening (= server morning). The choice of opponents was even more limited, being basically Dwarfs or more Dwarfs (4 teams). I offered to play the only one which was of similar TV to my own team (all the others had significantly higher TV, 20+ games under their belts, and at least 4 Mighty Blow players). Even this kind offer was refused.

By a miracle, a Halfling team appeared which accepted my challenge, and we had a nice tense and entertaining game.

Nearly all these tooled up (damage inflicting) bash teams today were lurking on Gamefinder a long time, indicating that they are not willing to play against each other...

I am a sporting coach, I am used to accepting say 75-100% of challenges in Ranked and Competitive. But I have to draw a line somewhere - playing tooled up Dwarfs/Chaos Dwarfs/Orcs every time is not likely to make for an enjoyable experience (nor for a squad that survives long, especially if it is a relatively weedy one like Imperials).

Let me know what you think, especially if you have experienced similar things. I make this post because I worry for the future of BB2020 Black Box and any other TV-matched environments if they go the same way.


Last edited by smeborg on Oct 23, 2021 - 11:55; edited 1 time in total
MiBasse



Joined: Dec 04, 2004

Post   Posted: Oct 23, 2021 - 11:54 Reply with quote Back to top

I mean... It's *possible*, but frankly, the number of games happening on a daily basis is probably too low to say anything about trends in such a short time frame. There's also going to be a bias, because as you sort of notice, bashy teams are going to be likely to be sticking around in the gamefinder longer than the non-bashy ones.
smeborg



Joined: Jan 04, 2019

Post   Posted: Oct 23, 2021 - 12:00 Reply with quote Back to top

Thanks! But I have noticed an increasing trend in this direction over the last several weeks. It is not just an anecdote.

I don't see why bashy teams should stick around any longer than other teams on Gamefinder if they are willing to challenge other bashy teams. Seems like an acute double standard to me.
MattDakka



Joined: Oct 09, 2007

Post   Posted: Oct 23, 2021 - 12:00 Reply with quote Back to top

With Season Redraft people will still play bash teams but they should be less developed than now.
Box Trophy should encourage some racial diversity.
It would be nice to have variety by activating at least 1 agile, 1 bash, 1 hybrid team.
garyt1



Joined: Mar 12, 2011

Post   Posted: Oct 23, 2021 - 12:04 Reply with quote Back to top

Weakening of claw mb, along with less skill growth brings back the lrb4 favourites. Plus bash play is relatively straightforward.

_________________
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MiBasse



Joined: Dec 04, 2004

Post   Posted: Oct 23, 2021 - 12:10 Reply with quote Back to top

smeborg wrote:
Thanks! But I have noticed an increasing trend in this direction over the last several weeks. It is not just an anecdote.

I don't see why bashy teams should stick around any longer than other teams on Gamefinder if they are willing to challenge other bashy teams. Seems like an acute double standard to me.


Well, the idea is that the fewer agile teams there are, the more attractive opponents they will be, so they'll have a wider pick of opponents, so they find games quicker and get off gamefinder quicker.

Yes, people will have double standards with playing vs bashers, so they won't search out others of the same ilk most of the time, so that's probably a factor.
MattDakka



Joined: Oct 09, 2007

Post   Posted: Oct 23, 2021 - 12:20 Reply with quote Back to top

RedFish wrote:

Yes, people will have double standards with playing vs bashers, so they won't search out others of the same ilk most of the time, so that's probably a factor.

With automatic MM bashers can't avoid bashers.
If bashers play vs other bashers often they more likely suffer injuries (especially considering than now MNG are more common).
That means that, if you face a bash team it could lack some key players (Guards, killers) so it would not be as in perfect shape as by picking non-bashy opponents on GF all time.


Last edited by MattDakka on Oct 23, 2021 - 12:24; edited 1 time in total
MiBasse



Joined: Dec 04, 2004

Post   Posted: Oct 23, 2021 - 12:23 Reply with quote Back to top

MattDakka wrote:
RedFish wrote:

Yes, people will have double standards with playing vs bashers, so they won't search out others of the same ilk most of the time, so that's probably a factor.

With automatic MM bashers can't avoid bashers.


Yes?

I'm not quite sure which part of my points that's supposed to address.
MerryZ



Joined: Nov 28, 2005

Post   Posted: Oct 23, 2021 - 12:24 Reply with quote Back to top

MattDakka wrote:
With Season Redraft people will still play bash teams but they should be less developed than now.
Box Trophy should encourage some racial diversity.
It would be nice to have variety by activating at least 1 agile, 1 bash, 1 hybrid team.


If you wanted diversity that way wouldnt activating tier 1, 2 and 3 be better than activating dark elves, orcs and undead ?
MattDakka



Joined: Oct 09, 2007

Post   Posted: Oct 23, 2021 - 12:25 Reply with quote Back to top

Not addressing you. I agree with you.
MattDakka



Joined: Oct 09, 2007

Post   Posted: Oct 23, 2021 - 12:28 Reply with quote Back to top

MerryZ wrote:

If you wanted diversity that way wouldnt activating tier 1, 2 and 3 be better than activating dark elves, orcs and undead ?

I will do it, as soon as Christer migrates my Box teams to the Competitive division.
I can't find good team names for the other races.
Tier 3, never again. The CR won/lost is not worth the difficulty of playing a tier 3.
I used to activate in the Box maximum 1 team per race, of different kinds (bash, agile, hybrid), so, it's not a problem for me. I did it even in CRP, where everybody cpombed in the Box.
In my utopic world (with bacon if you like it) everybody should activate at least 1 agile, 1 bash, 1 hybrid.
MerryZ



Joined: Nov 28, 2005

Post   Posted: Oct 23, 2021 - 12:36 Reply with quote Back to top

My point just was that activating darkies, orcs and undead doesnt bring much diversity.
MattDakka



Joined: Oct 09, 2007

Post   Posted: Oct 23, 2021 - 12:39 Reply with quote Back to top

Still better than activating only Dwarfs or Orcs.
And by the way I don't have any Undead team in Competitive, I have Chaos Dwarfs, Orcs, Dark Elves, Wood Elves.
MerryZ



Joined: Nov 28, 2005

Post   Posted: Oct 23, 2021 - 12:43 Reply with quote Back to top

No. Really it is just the same.
ClayInfinity



Joined: Aug 15, 2003

Post   Posted: Oct 23, 2021 - 12:57 Reply with quote Back to top

I do agree. Have been playing Nobles, Underworld, Pro, Dark and High elves and a really bad Black Orc team.

I feel its alot of bash teams as well but as has been said, lower TV means less kill stacks.

For me, I cherrypick based on Dedicated Fans.... no use playing bash teams and not getting a decent purse!
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