Renno
Joined: Jun 17, 2004
|
 Posted:
Jul 04, 2004 - 22:49 |
 
|
1) Dirty Player would be balanced if it was harder for strength teams to get. Everything is stacked against AV7 teams.
2) Strength teams already have several advantages.
2a) Most obvious strength and strength skills namely "Mighty Blow"
2b) Chaos/Nurgles have an extra advantage being able to get Claw/Razor Sharp Claws and Necromantic can start with 2 Claws.
2c) Highest AV (Leading to a lot fewer players dying.)
2d) Cheapest players.
3) Because of this strength teams rarely have to replace players while just under normal blocking conditions speed teams, mainly AV 7 teams are always replacing players under normal conditions without dealing with Dirty Player.
It's just far to easy for strength teams to annihilate speed teams making for easy wins while it can be pretty frustrating to play a speed/low av team. And ironically it's strength teams that foul the most.
Cowards!  |
|
|
mattydontlikeit
Joined: Jun 10, 2004
|
| Posted:
Jul 04, 2004 - 22:57 |
|
I'm pretty new on FUMBBL, but not to BB (I played with the original rules published in White Dwarf magazine and have been a player of every version of the rules published since). This argument has been going on for a long, long time. Yes, DP can mess your team up but bad. Yes, it seems unethical to use it to foul your opponents' teams into unplayability. No, it's no fun to watch your players die while a bunch of filthy goblins run up the score. That said, it is part of the game, and in my opinion a valuable part. My own preference in teams runs toward elves. I love the finesse game, when it works. However, not much is more satisfying than a good solid block that ends with a SI or RIP. Moreso online, what with the crunchy sound effects. I am not a fouler, nor a fan of foulers. But in the case of an opponent's DP, I am always willing to make an exception. I always check my opponent's team out before I play them. If there is a DP on the team, I will initially give them the benefit of the doubt and assume that guy is there as a self-defensive measure. The first time my opponent throws a foul of any kind with any player, however, that DP becomes my target. I will key in on the disgraceful bastard and do everything in my power to KILL IT. No one will get taught any lessons this way, and the BB world will not become a better place, but killing a DP is the single most satisfying thing I have ever done across a tabletop. I find that people who spend the most time whining about fouling are those who, like it or not, have allowed themselves to be victimized by the practice. Don't be a wuss. Kill the DP, save your team. Just my two copper pieces. |
|
|
Ziechyel
Joined: Jun 15, 2004
|
| Posted:
Jul 05, 2004 - 00:04 |
|
Well i think i have waitet long enough with my opinion....
1) I think Fouling should only be used as a tactical mean...
2) There should´nt be a Dirty player skill... it simply ruins the game, and its no fun to play against...
3) I know alot of people who foul all the time... and belive me! No one wants to play against them...
4) when that is said, if you dont like "foulers" dont play against them, you can see their roster, if there is a DP DONT PLAY against the team... simpel as that...
I know fouling is a part of the game, but again i think it should only be used, when its to stop a TD, Starplayer or the likes.... not just to jump up and down, to crush another team... Just because you like to kill players...
(sorry for mis-spelling, English is not my main language...)
Happy now??? you are really creative... learned that in kindergarden? |
Last edited by Ziechyel on %b %05, %2004 - %00:%Jul; edited 1 time in total |
|
Zy-Nox
Joined: Aug 02, 2003
|
| Posted:
Jul 05, 2004 - 00:13 |
|
Hmmmmmm, I have a new theory.
We change the name of the skill *dirty player* to something that doesnt sound so brutal. How about *Tickle with feather duster* skill . Basically Its the same as DP just sounds nicer for all those who dont like it ;p |
_________________
"Who made that girly Zy-kNox Mod?"
Anarchy Online |
|
AvatarDM
Joined: Aug 02, 2003
|
| Posted:
Jul 05, 2004 - 00:35 |
|
I remember someone calling his DP in his Wood Elf team "Armor Specialist"... maybe we should change the name to that :=) |
|
|
Zy-Nox
Joined: Aug 02, 2003
|
| Posted:
Jul 05, 2004 - 14:19 |
|
Poll? |
_________________
"Who made that girly Zy-kNox Mod?"
Anarchy Online |
|
Zeb_one
Joined: May 18, 2004
|
| Posted:
Jul 05, 2004 - 15:41 |
|
Hey stevie. If you read this, plz tell me what tbh is an abbrevation for. "The Bloody Hill" ?
Peace out and roger wilco tango fab five
-The Million Dollar man cometh
and so on... |
|
|
Mnemok
Joined: Feb 11, 2004
|
| Posted:
Jul 05, 2004 - 16:22 |
|
To all those players out there who doesn't see the difference between MB,Claw, RSC and the discussed skill DP. This might help you.
1. The skill is very easy to get, no doubles, no strength skill access.
2. Using it is very easy, see someone lying down, there you are.
3. No risk involved (physically ( digitaly)) for the player, just make an armor roll.
4. Never fails, no skull, no ones like GFI etc.
5. You can assist in the armor roll, making it an effective 2+ on injury roll.
Since the only risk you run is having a (mostly expendable) player thrown out of the game, the benefit outweights the risk by zillions (alot).
These are the reasons why DP is popular for teams who like putting key players out of the game, but unfortunatly the same reason applies for teams with inept or sadistic coaches (often with lots of cheap linemen).
The latter beeing the reason for this thread to start, as I understand it. |
_________________
Dyslexics have more fnu. |
|
Smess
Joined: Feb 13, 2004
|
| Posted:
Jul 05, 2004 - 17:44 |
|
Best point made so far in my opinion: Mezir (page 5)
Just to be clear: next remarks are in no means a personal attack, i'm just not agreeing. (Isn't it nice that everyone can have different opinions?)
DaBoss: I believe you've got it all wrong if you think AV7 are disadvantaged (WE and skaven are kickass teams). All teams are quite well balanced at the moment (exept for the woodies with their tree maybe (btw i love playing woodies)). All teams have their strenghts and weaknesses, and they all can be defeated.
Mnemok: All ' ST teams' can get mighty blow and guard, no doubles (mostly). The risk you take by fouling is getting sent off, without having hurt the other guy (that's when you fail a foul) and ending up with less players on the field than your opponent, instead of more.
As so many others have already pointed out: there are lots and lots of strategies to prevent your opponent from fouling effectively. |
|
|
CircularLogic
Joined: Aug 22, 2003
|
| Posted:
Jul 05, 2004 - 17:45 |
|
Key Player is the keyword here.
DP is siuted, to get one hated player (BigGuy, RSC/Claw-CW/ST4-Wardacer etc.) off the pitch, who could really mess up your game.
To tone down the power of mass-fouling without reducing its power for a tactical strike, there are 2 possibilities:
1) Limit DP to one player per team. The officials would clean up the team, if there would be too much fouler.
2) Give mods to the ref-roll depending on the foul-result. +1 for KO and +2 for a cas would have the desired effect. Without the Eye on you, are more likely to get your target off the pitch than to get ejected. If you foul on with the eye, you would get 5 DPs ejected in exchange for 4 opposing players. All statistically.. |
|
|
Afro
Joined: Aug 02, 2003
|
| Posted:
Jul 05, 2004 - 17:51 |
|
Maybe some didn't notice it, but nearly every Coach can get some of the DPs very easy. And even a poor WE Lineman can get a ST7 Nurgle Beast out of the game with this skill. Just give him the boot, problem soved. So no race is privileged on this skill, but some coaches prefer dodge or side step, but you can't blame someone for taking DP (and using it, like most coaches do with dodge). |
_________________
Luck is only for dumb people |
|
CircularLogic
Joined: Aug 22, 2003
|
| Posted:
Jul 05, 2004 - 19:32 |
|
[irony]
Dodge is even worse!
With DP, you might get a player off the pitch, but with dodge, you denie them SPP in two ways:
1) You can dodge away every turn, reducing the number of blocks your opponent can throw.
2) You are much harder to knock down.
Everytime you dodge away, you denie your opponent at least 0,06 (AV9)SPP from not being able to block you!! And all you AV7-Elves denie 0,14 SPP WITH EVERY DODGE!!! Considering the amount of dodges from those pesky woodies, they kill my team by SPP-denial as dodge destroys more SPP, then DP does by the occasional RIP.
Conclusion:
BAN DODGE!!
It´s aimed at teamdestruction!
[/irony] |
|
|
Renno
Joined: Jun 17, 2004
|
| Posted:
Jul 05, 2004 - 19:51 |
|
Circular... Buy 'Tackle' instead of 'Mighty Blow'. |
|
|
Mnemok
Joined: Feb 11, 2004
|
| Posted:
Jul 05, 2004 - 20:12 |
|
Sorry Smess, if you misunderstood me. I wasn´t talking about specific races. Everybody can get DP and that is the point.
The risk of being sent off is small compared to the damage you can make and you can replace the player by next setup and use him again in next game. Try to setup a dead one (not undead one). |
_________________
Dyslexics have more fnu. |
|
CircularLogic
Joined: Aug 22, 2003
|
| Posted:
Jul 05, 2004 - 22:02 |
|
Wow.. by taking dodge, my opponent forces me to choose tackle... that´s just evil and further proves, that dodge is WAY to strong.
DP doesn´t force me to choose certain skills nor does mighty blow... |
|
|
|
|
| |
Gnome Roster - how a...
Search
