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2022-12-06 06:48:58
20 votes, rating 4.9
20 votes, rating 4.9
I hate Bomber Dribblesnot.
See subject line. I also think that I will not be fond of Cindy.
I'm going to petition Games Workshop to change the name of Blood Bowl to "Bomber and Friends!"
Call me crazy, and I haven't looked back at my games to confirm this, but I feel as though I've been facing Bomber Dribblesnot a lot lately. Does anyone else feel this? Win or lose, I'm just tired of facing him. And yes I just lost handily to a Bomber and Friends team of Orcs. They were absolutely poetic in their dismantling of my Tomb Kings team, and by the third or fourth turn I had about half my team left on the pitch. It wasn't all Bomber, but he certainly was a catalyst. So yes, I'm writing a rage post and am feeling a little biased.
Honestly, am I the only one who is feeling that the Star Player "meta" is not entirely good for the game? I'm just worried that some combinations of players will be too good to pass up and the game stagnates. I've found that there is a small core of Star Players that are being used and even they are being eclipsed by Bomber. Is it that the Bombardier trait is that good, or that Bomber can play for teams that greatly benefit from his services more than any other Star? A combination I'm sure. I'm curious if any of you reading this believe that Bomber is becoming a little too common and may be too effective for his cost. I'm sure many of you hold the opinion that it's cool, and I'm imagining things.
If anyone out there played Guild Ball, I think you'll understand what I'm getting at. A cautionary tale of a game with a host of characters of which only a few were used because of their effectiveness. I'm sure Blood Bowl will not go down the same path or share the same fate as Guild Ball, but I'd be lying if I said I wasn't a little worried about it.
I'm going to petition Games Workshop to change the name of Blood Bowl to "Bomber and Friends!"
Call me crazy, and I haven't looked back at my games to confirm this, but I feel as though I've been facing Bomber Dribblesnot a lot lately. Does anyone else feel this? Win or lose, I'm just tired of facing him. And yes I just lost handily to a Bomber and Friends team of Orcs. They were absolutely poetic in their dismantling of my Tomb Kings team, and by the third or fourth turn I had about half my team left on the pitch. It wasn't all Bomber, but he certainly was a catalyst. So yes, I'm writing a rage post and am feeling a little biased.
Honestly, am I the only one who is feeling that the Star Player "meta" is not entirely good for the game? I'm just worried that some combinations of players will be too good to pass up and the game stagnates. I've found that there is a small core of Star Players that are being used and even they are being eclipsed by Bomber. Is it that the Bombardier trait is that good, or that Bomber can play for teams that greatly benefit from his services more than any other Star? A combination I'm sure. I'm curious if any of you reading this believe that Bomber is becoming a little too common and may be too effective for his cost. I'm sure many of you hold the opinion that it's cool, and I'm imagining things.
If anyone out there played Guild Ball, I think you'll understand what I'm getting at. A cautionary tale of a game with a host of characters of which only a few were used because of their effectiveness. I'm sure Blood Bowl will not go down the same path or share the same fate as Guild Ball, but I'd be lying if I said I wasn't a little worried about it.
Comments
Posted by spelledaren on 2022-12-06 07:56:10
Star Bowl seems stupid.
Encourages playing in League without it.
Encourages playing in League without it.
Posted by HimalayaP1C7 on 2022-12-06 08:51:48
I think it's a very common feeling. Bomber is too cheap. He's available to too many teams. Bomb fails don't cause turnovers. Bombs have mighty blow. He has accurate so at short range he rarely misses. Kaboom is a really strong special skill.
The new FAQ change to inducements might improve things a little (not implemented on FUMBBL yet though). But then again, soon we'll have Cindy (only slightly worse than Bomber) and more teams will have a good bomber (Ogres will have 2).
He's really annoying but I hope that we can learn good strategies against him, does anyone have any good strategies against Bomber/Cindy they can recommend?
The new FAQ change to inducements might improve things a little (not implemented on FUMBBL yet though). But then again, soon we'll have Cindy (only slightly worse than Bomber) and more teams will have a good bomber (Ogres will have 2).
He's really annoying but I hope that we can learn good strategies against him, does anyone have any good strategies against Bomber/Cindy they can recommend?
Posted by JanMattys on 2022-12-06 09:06:17
And now the old world teams will have their own bomber too, for 50k.
Cindy Piewhistle.
Cindy Piewhistle.
Posted by MattDakka on 2022-12-06 11:32:25
Even with good tactics there still the chance that Bomber will hit your ball carrier (Inaccurate Bombs can still be close enough to knock down a screen player protecting the ball carrier).
So, for sure Bomber is too good for the price and too common.
Also, the new Inducement system will make him less common, but that doesn't cancel the fact that he's too cheap for the potential.
Moreover: is the bomb escalation with Cindy addition so good? This should be a tactical game. Bombers remove lot of tactics from the game.
So, for sure Bomber is too good for the price and too common.
Also, the new Inducement system will make him less common, but that doesn't cancel the fact that he's too cheap for the potential.
Moreover: is the bomb escalation with Cindy addition so good? This should be a tactical game. Bombers remove lot of tactics from the game.
Posted by razmus on 2022-12-06 12:57:17
The problem is less that Dribblesnot is available to too MANY teams, but that he's not available to EVERY teams. In that Khemri vs Orc game, you and your opponent both spent from your treasuries. If you'd had access to the Dribblesnot, and you knew your opponent had hired him.. would you have forgone the purchase of a keg of Bloodweiser to prevent the Dribblesnot from taking to the pitch?
Posted by Mnemon on 2022-12-06 13:28:42
"This should be a tactical game."
I don't think that is the intent of GW. It's not the game they design, it's the one many players aim to play.
I don't think that is the intent of GW. It's not the game they design, it's the one many players aim to play.
Posted by MattDakka on 2022-12-06 14:08:14
Ok, if this is not a tactical game, then let's give every team a free Bomber.
If we want to roll dice mindlessly, let's give everybody the chance to do it, at least.
If we want to roll dice mindlessly, let's give everybody the chance to do it, at least.
Posted by MattDakka on 2022-12-06 14:11:09
@razmus: assuming that everybody could hire Bomber, there would be 2 issues:
1) not every team swims in gold to hire Bomber. High AV teams tend to have gold to spend freely, agile and/or fragile teams struggle just to replace their players;
2) 50k is too cheap. He should be priced 100k, at least. That would discourage hiring him often.
1) not every team swims in gold to hire Bomber. High AV teams tend to have gold to spend freely, agile and/or fragile teams struggle just to replace their players;
2) 50k is too cheap. He should be priced 100k, at least. That would discourage hiring him often.
Posted by razmus on 2022-12-06 14:28:33
@MattDakka -- (Assuming every team COULD hire a Dribblesnot) As the rule that overdog hiring is implemented so that the underdog gets that money too... overdog hiring of a Dribblesnot should disappear because it's a no brainer to pay to keep him off the pitch. At that point, it does become a question if the overdog has the cash or willingness to pay a 50k insurance premium to keep him off the pitch.
I'd further argue that fragile/agile teams also TEND to be the underdog teams, so if they just use the extra petty cash to pay their Dribblesnot insurance premium, the problem goes away. And if they are actually the overdog, they're almost certainly in the best position of ANYONE to deal with a Dribblesnot on the field.
I'd further argue that fragile/agile teams also TEND to be the underdog teams, so if they just use the extra petty cash to pay their Dribblesnot insurance premium, the problem goes away. And if they are actually the overdog, they're almost certainly in the best position of ANYONE to deal with a Dribblesnot on the field.
Posted by MattDakka on 2022-12-06 15:01:49
Elves don't have access to Bomber, for the record, even if they wanted to hire him to keep off the pitch they couldn't.
Posted by MattDakka on 2022-12-06 15:04:31
The problem is that Blood Bowl has many blatant TV calculation errors.
Tackle on Dwarfs and Chaos Dwarfs is too cheap, then, when you add to that error an underpriced Star Player, these flaws stack and games get very unbalanced.
Tackle on Dwarfs and Chaos Dwarfs is too cheap, then, when you add to that error an underpriced Star Player, these flaws stack and games get very unbalanced.
Posted by SideshowBob on 2022-12-06 15:21:30
I am all aboard the hate train
Posted by MattDakka on 2022-12-06 16:14:57
As an aside: giving bomber Star Players to tier 3 teams such as Halflings, Goblins, Ogres could make sense, because they are really weak and even with bombs they still would not be too good, but allowing tier 1 teams to get a cheap Bomber is a recipe for unbalanced games. I would bring back the -1 Stunty malus to pass as well. That would make the bombs a bit harder to throw.
I use to hire a Weather Mage to give Bomber a malus when I need to move closer to him but even with Very Sunny -1 the bombs are still too easy to throw.
I use to hire a Weather Mage to give Bomber a malus when I need to move closer to him but even with Very Sunny -1 the bombs are still too easy to throw.
Posted by Carthage on 2022-12-06 16:15:59
Choo choo, hate train gets another car added.
Posted by MattDakka on 2022-12-06 16:23:36
By the way, I still have to understand why a Catcher should use Catch to re-roll a bomb catch.
There should be an option to refuse to catch a bomb/using Catch to re-roll a failed bomb catch.
"Hey, there is a bomb flying... I want to catch it...!"
Players should be able to try to deflect the bombs, not to catch them.
If you see a bomb flying you try to hit it away from you, you don't try hard to catch it.
There should be an option to refuse to catch a bomb/using Catch to re-roll a failed bomb catch.
"Hey, there is a bomb flying... I want to catch it...!"
Players should be able to try to deflect the bombs, not to catch them.
If you see a bomb flying you try to hit it away from you, you don't try hard to catch it.
Posted by Chewblocka on 2022-12-06 17:07:19
Glad to see that I'm not the only one out there who is suffering from Bomber induced fatigue. Some valid points have been made in regard to the number of teams he can play for and his low-cost/high-value, however, is there anyone who hasn't yet hitched their car to the Train of Hate?
I'd hate to cancel the player outright, but as some have mentioned there seems to be little downside to throwing a bomb. How does Games Workshop deal with this? How do we as a community deal with it? I'm on the verge of playing only Badlands Brawl/Underworld Challenge teams so as to properly ensure that I don't face Bomber. That is until Cindy Piewhistle takes to the pitch.
So maybe the answer to my question on how Games Workshop will deal with this issue is simply more bombs. With this in mind, I renew my petition to Games Workshop to rename Blood Bowl to Bomber & Friends. I would also ask that any of us looking to avail ourselves of the scourge of the bombardier to please share any knowledge on how to best counter this menace. That is my answer to how we as a community can hope to deal with... the bomb.
I'd hate to cancel the player outright, but as some have mentioned there seems to be little downside to throwing a bomb. How does Games Workshop deal with this? How do we as a community deal with it? I'm on the verge of playing only Badlands Brawl/Underworld Challenge teams so as to properly ensure that I don't face Bomber. That is until Cindy Piewhistle takes to the pitch.
So maybe the answer to my question on how Games Workshop will deal with this issue is simply more bombs. With this in mind, I renew my petition to Games Workshop to rename Blood Bowl to Bomber & Friends. I would also ask that any of us looking to avail ourselves of the scourge of the bombardier to please share any knowledge on how to best counter this menace. That is my answer to how we as a community can hope to deal with... the bomb.
Posted by Mnemon on 2022-12-06 17:24:04
"I would also ask that any of us looking to avail ourselves of the scourge of the bombardier to please share any knowledge on how to best counter this menace. That is my answer to how we as a community can hope to deal with... the bomb."
Score quickly. Then defend well.
Score quickly. Then defend well.
Posted by MattDakka on 2022-12-06 17:46:24
Score quickly, get outnumbered (because Bomber tends to be hired by bash teams), lose the game.
If I scored quickly with DE or other Elves vs Bomber I would lose most of my games vs him.
If I scored quickly with DE or other Elves vs Bomber I would lose most of my games vs him.
Posted by MattDakka on 2022-12-06 17:48:09
I'd rename Blood Bowl to Bomb Bowl, not Bomber & Friends. :D
The game of Fantasy Bombing.
The game of Fantasy Bombing.
Posted by MattDakka on 2022-12-06 17:53:24
And by the way, I remember a game where Bomber was ejected 3 times and the call was argued successfully 3 times. So, even scoring fast is not a guarantee to remove him. Argue the call is possible (or even a bribe).
Posted by krogmonster on 2022-12-06 18:10:34
I have not played against bomber specifically, but I have played several times against snotlings with their fungus flingers.
I have read the Bombardier entry in the book and I am really not clear as to why a turnover is not caused when you hit your own team? Per the Bombardier text, players hit by the bomb are "knocked down", and if any of the active teams players are knocked down, per page 23, that is a turnover.
I have read the Bombardier entry in the book and I am really not clear as to why a turnover is not caused when you hit your own team? Per the Bombardier text, players hit by the bomb are "knocked down", and if any of the active teams players are knocked down, per page 23, that is a turnover.
Posted by Burtblahblahblah on 2022-12-06 18:55:33
It's the one thing where I think fumbbl rules should deviate from GW rules. Just make Bomber available to goblins and no one else. They're a pretty terrible team and Bomber slightly mitigates that. Why on earth can orcs access an overpowered, underpriced star player when they're one of the best teams in the game? Bonkers!!
Posted by DragonBallZac on 2022-12-06 19:21:57
I faced him so much with him decimating my team that I myself joined the dark side and until something changes you almost have to play a team that can use him in the box. That has been the only thing I have found just play a team that can use him as well and either make a pact with a coach that neither one of you will buy bomber, I have that with a few coaches, or buy him to keep the other coach from having him. Half the time he kills himself but when he doesnt he kills the other team. I am a part of the problem because I couldnt find a solution other than overbuying a wizard and turning him into a frog.... he really has changed the feel of blood bowl in 2020 though
Posted by koadah on 2022-12-06 20:01:49
Give every team Bomber or Cindy.
It is only fair.
And a +2DP gobbo!
It is only fair.
And a +2DP gobbo!
Posted by Chrisdekok on 2022-12-06 20:35:36
Or add a skeleton/zombie bomber and a beastman bomber and everyone can take part in the bombing fun! An elf bomber would probably be too unrealistic.
Posted by MattDakka on 2022-12-06 20:37:44
As an aside, does anybody know what Cindy's special rule "All you can eat" does?
I'm curious.
If "All you can eat" special rule is not as good as "Ka-Boom!" special rule then giving every team either Bomber or Cindy would still not be fair.
#badmechanics #sounfair :P
I'm curious.
If "All you can eat" special rule is not as good as "Ka-Boom!" special rule then giving every team either Bomber or Cindy would still not be fair.
#badmechanics #sounfair :P
Posted by MrCushtie on 2022-12-06 21:23:33
Induce a wizard, turn Bomber into a frog. Don't get Bomber on the other team? Now you have a wizard! Yay
Posted by grant85 on 2022-12-07 00:41:54
All you can eat: once a game, Cindy can toss 2 bombs in the same turn.
Posted by razmus on 2022-12-07 02:19:26
@krogmonster - Blood Bowl Errata -- page 10 in the current (Nov 2022):
" Page 83 – Bombardier
- Change the third bullet point in the final set of bullet
points to read:
Any Standing players hit by the explosion are Placed Prone."
" Page 83 – Bombardier
- Change the third bullet point in the final set of bullet
points to read:
Any Standing players hit by the explosion are Placed Prone."
Posted by C0ddlefish on 2022-12-07 10:40:36
I have some hope the new inducements rule will help reduce Bomber/Cindy a little.
My logic is:
1. If I'm the bigger team and I take Bomber, do they have access too to cancel it out?
2. Would they likely take bomber anyway, so do I block him in advance?
3. If I take Bomber does it mean they jump up to other star access e.g. They couldnt, but now can have Morg.
As the smaller team, I'll know to block bomber if the bigger team takes him, unless point 3 is an interesting option.
My logic is:
1. If I'm the bigger team and I take Bomber, do they have access too to cancel it out?
2. Would they likely take bomber anyway, so do I block him in advance?
3. If I take Bomber does it mean they jump up to other star access e.g. They couldnt, but now can have Morg.
As the smaller team, I'll know to block bomber if the bigger team takes him, unless point 3 is an interesting option.
Posted by SanKuKai on 2022-12-07 11:13:51
hello
does anybody knows WHEN Cindy will be implemented as a star player ?
does anybody knows WHEN Cindy will be implemented as a star player ?
Posted by MattDakka on 2022-12-07 12:21:57
@grant85: Thank you!
Posted by BigChiefSittingDuck on 2022-12-07 22:57:10
He is definitely overpowered for the price. Sadly another example of the new GW team not properly thinking about game balance and just randomly chucking stuff out thinking 'hey wouldn't it be cool if this player could do this' (and to be cynical, maybe also thinking 'hey we can sell loads of minis of this star player'), and not properly play-testing. See also Morg with +2 on MB - far, far stronger than 'just double the hit'. Most games get more balanced with age and new versions - not this one sadly, or at least not any more.