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Heroic_Tackle



Joined: Nov 05, 2006

Post   Posted: Aug 14, 2020 - 00:29 Reply with quote Back to top

I am sorry if this was posted already but I just don´t get it. The new rules are meant to buff passing and Throwers, right?

Then why did they introduce this new Wildly Inaccurate result? It seems to me when making a pass that is not a Quick Pass, the chance that something goes horribly wrong increases. It might not be a Fumble, but deviating 1D6 from the Throwers square to me is an additional chance to get a very bad result, an increased chance to fail at passing.

New rules:
Short Pass, bad results 1 + 2.
Long Pass, bad results 1, 2 + 3.
Long Bomb, bad results 1, 2, 3 + 4.

Old rules:
Short Pass, bad results 1.
Long Pass, bad results 1 + 2.
Long Bomb, bad results 1, 2 + 3.

Now, Inaccurate is also a fail, but at least the Pass reaches the target square and scatters. This result while still bad I vastly prefer to a Wildly Inaccurate result.

Regardless what your PA is, the chance for Wildly Inaccurate is the same. That is horrible.

Is a dedicated Thrower with PA+2 now also expected to take Accurate and/or Cannoneer?

It looks to me that Passing got worse, even for Throwers. Passing is not just Quick Pass, Mr. Designer?

Am I understanding it wrong? Am I missing something? Am I overreacting? I don´t understand these rules, that seem to be a buff and a nerf at the same time, compared to the old stuff.


Confused
Uber



Joined: Mar 22, 2004

Post   Posted: Aug 14, 2020 - 00:49 Reply with quote Back to top

Bad is the new good, didn't you get the memo?

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steinerp



Joined: Sep 18, 2005

Post   Posted: Aug 14, 2020 - 01:16 Reply with quote Back to top

Bad passers got better (but still mostly bad), good passers got worse
Matthueycamo



Joined: May 16, 2014

Post   Posted: Aug 14, 2020 - 01:41 Reply with quote Back to top

Most player's passing ability got nerfed, most passing skills got nerfed, the passing table got nerfed. Oh and this new deflecting nonsense making it more risky to throw.

Result nobody passes better than they used to, some are just lucky to pass about as good as before out the box but a developed thrower under the old rules passes better than a developed thrower under the new rules.

Welcome to bashfest 2020. To me at least making passing more viable can't have been a design choice.

ps. elves are screwed.
Niessuh



Joined: Dec 11, 2009

Post   Posted: Aug 14, 2020 - 10:51 Reply with quote Back to top

This is not fantasy football anymore.

This is fantasy rugby now!

Thanks to fumblerooskie and using surehands you could do N [fumblerooskie players] drop the ball plus one hand off per turn. Drop the ball is a move action.

So using two wood elf throwers with fumblerooskie and a catcher, you could easily (2+ pick ball/catch with auto RR) move the ball 22 tiles. Almost the entire BB field length.

Forget about accurate, cannoneer, cloud buster, dumpoff, hail mary pass, pass, running pass, safe pass, diving catch...just need fumblerooskie and sure hands, which is always very helpfull (sacking sacking sacking).


Last edited by Niessuh on Aug 14, 2020 - 12:02; edited 3 times in total
Muff2n



Joined: May 20, 2017

Post   Posted: Aug 14, 2020 - 10:59 Reply with quote Back to top

I agree with you, the implementation of wildly inaccurate is awful. If my maths is correct, it means that any player with PA 2+ can only get accurate, wildly inaccurate or fumble. It is not possible for them to just roll inaccurate!
Heroic_Tackle



Joined: Nov 05, 2006

Post   Posted: Aug 14, 2020 - 11:44 Reply with quote Back to top

Wooow, I can't believe it. If they don't errata that ASAP that is just insane.

They should delete Wildly Inaccurate. Make Fumble only on a natural One.

I mean, they should have not gone this way. They could have made Throwers PA+2, or PA+3 and old Accurate for free .Then they could have given non-Throwers PA3+ (or worse). No Wildly Inaccurate and you maybe get a better effect than this mess.Oh, and they should have not increased the price to hire a Thrower.

I really wonder, as a Skaven player, will I even take the "buffed", more expensive Thrower. That is just insane to me.
PaddyMick



Joined: Jan 03, 2012

Post   Posted: Aug 14, 2020 - 12:41 Reply with quote Back to top

Heroic_Tackle wrote:
If they don't errata that ASAP that is just insane.


Yeah you're right it seems crazy, but hey can't errata it since they havn't released the rules yet. Maybe they will fix it before release. Maybe this whole 'leak' has been designed to get some free feedback and even playtesting done by ordinary players. But probably not XD
Balle2000



Joined: Sep 25, 2008

Post   Posted: Aug 14, 2020 - 13:06 Reply with quote Back to top

Rules haven't been released yet.

Games haven't been played yet.

Yes, its definitely TIME TO PANIC!!!!!

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Izzinatah



Joined: Apr 06, 2009

Post   Posted: Aug 14, 2020 - 13:09 Reply with quote Back to top

Edit: deleted to avoid confusion


Last edited by Izzinatah on Aug 14, 2020 - 15:06; edited 1 time in total
Heroic_Tackle



Joined: Nov 05, 2006

Post   Posted: Aug 14, 2020 - 13:19 Reply with quote Back to top

@Balle and Paddy: I hope you are right.

In the meantime it looks dire.
Izzinatah



Joined: Apr 06, 2009

Post   Posted: Aug 14, 2020 - 13:32 Reply with quote Back to top

Edit: deleted to avoid confusion


Last edited by Izzinatah on Aug 14, 2020 - 15:06; edited 2 times in total
MattDakka



Joined: Oct 09, 2007

Post   Posted: Aug 14, 2020 - 13:39 Reply with quote Back to top

If passing is worse and riskier than now, people will just run the ball.
SquirrelDude



Joined: Mar 22, 2015

Post   Posted: Aug 14, 2020 - 14:04 Reply with quote Back to top

It's an awkward rule-set to compare as most players actually receive an upgrade to their passing number as compared to the current edition, but the difficulty of passes was then increased by one.

The leaked ruleset shows a version of passing where players are less to be accurate. The trade off is that they have also become much less likely to fumble, trading that off for wildly inaccurate. Here is that visualized:

Image

Unfortunately wildly inaccurate is a deviates rather than a scatter, and will extremely difficult to account for when planning a turn. In many cases it will be worse than a fumbled pass.

Bear in mind The leaked version of the wildly inaccurate rule is broken. PA 1+ doesn't do anything in the rules, and it makes you inaccurate on a modified roll of <1. If that is the version that makes it to print, expect there to be short turnaround on errata. Other tweaks to passing may come with it.


Last edited by SquirrelDude on Aug 14, 2020 - 14:06; edited 1 time in total
Heroic_Tackle



Joined: Nov 05, 2006

Post   Posted: Aug 14, 2020 - 14:06 Reply with quote Back to top

@ Izzinatah: Huh? AG 4 Current rules throws a short Pass. 1 is a Fumble, 2 is Inaccurate, 3+ is accurate.

Edit: Ninjaed bei Sqiurell Dude Smile
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