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Poll
Streaming live your match on TwitchTV personal channel....
Hey! Wait ! My opponent should ask mine consent!
30%
 30%  [ 45 ]
Yes! I want to be an Internet Movie MegaStar! And pay me royalties!
13%
 13%  [ 20 ]
GASP! Shocked! I will leave FUMBBL and internet and I will recover in an old Monastery
2%
 2%  [ 4 ]
TwitchTV? what is TV? What is Internet? I know only www.fumbbl.com
7%
 7%  [ 11 ]
I think it can be done or not, it does not hurt me at all...
38%
 38%  [ 58 ]
Will trow a pie in face of .... (you chose the coach-name ;-) !!!
7%
 7%  [ 11 ]
Total Votes : 149


Mingoose



Joined: Jul 28, 2016

Post   Posted: Jun 29, 2023 - 16:28 Reply with quote Back to top

Verminardo wrote:
[There is no moral imperative here. There is just the question of whether you want to be nice to other people and considerate of their sentiments, or not.


Isn’t being nice a moral imperative?

I personally have no issue being streamed. I find it sad and weird, but have fun with it. The thing that raised my eyebrows is when you ask people to perform a courtesy that requires virtually no effort, and the pushback is “no, I will never do you that courtesy, and you can’t make me”. Imagine your spouse asks you to put down the toilet seat and your response is “No, my personal philosophy is that you should put it down yourself if you want it down”.

Being nice is absolutely a moral imperative. It is not a strict imperative on the internet, but the lack of rules enforcing courtesy does not mean we should be flagrantly discourteous. Especially when streamers make their livelihood on the backs of these folks they are thumbing their nose at. Imagine any other industry where a business goes on a podcast and declare that they are miserable bastards and don’t give a lick about their critical vendors. It may behoove those streamers to change their attitude, be grateful they have people to make money off of, and perform the dozen keystrokes which constitute the courtesy demands.
Verminardo



Joined: Sep 27, 2006

Post   Posted: Jun 29, 2023 - 16:44 Reply with quote Back to top

Have you ever seen a talk show on TV?
Storr



Joined: Mar 25, 2020

Post   Posted: Jun 29, 2023 - 19:46 Reply with quote Back to top

If being nice is a moral imperative, why do you behave like you do?
moph



Joined: Sep 16, 2020

Post   Posted: Jun 29, 2023 - 20:00 Reply with quote Back to top

mekutata wrote:
So if I have an AI bot that can play decent bb (but probably always needs 4 minutes), and is also connected to chatgpt and able to trash talk to a twitch community... is it allowed to play bb and I can stream it?
I think if I'd design a minor looking girl in anime style as avatar I could make huge money that way.

The only ones making money by fumbbl being streamed are Jeff Bezos and his shareholders, I would asume. (And that is for me the main problem with twitch streaming.)

mekutata wrote:
Second question, if a streamer earns money by playing... shouldn't they pay part of that money to their opponent?
The German Chess Federation has had a legal opinion drawn up on whether the players have a "Urheberrecht"(similiar to, but not the same as copyright) on their games. They came to the conclusion that a Urheberrecht in chess games is to be denied under German law. Chess games are not worth protecting. Note that this is an expert opinion, not Judges Decision or Law. The reason for that was that Players wanted to get paid for their games being printed in publications.

In German: https://www.schachbund.de/recht-news/urheberrecht-an-schachpartien.html
RDaneel



Joined: Feb 24, 2023

Post   Posted: Jun 29, 2023 - 20:49 Reply with quote Back to top

Mingoose wrote:


Being nice is absolutely a moral imperative.


+1
mekutata



Joined: May 03, 2015

Post   Posted: Jun 29, 2023 - 22:21 Reply with quote Back to top

moph wrote:

In German: https://www.schachbund.de/recht-news/urheberrecht-an-schachpartien.html


Dats really great, but fumbbl does not only include the actual game but also our haikus in game chat.

So I will only play 4 minutes from now on when I face a twitch witch unless they offer me money.

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mekutata



Joined: May 03, 2015

Post   Posted: Jun 29, 2023 - 22:22 Reply with quote Back to top

RDaneel wrote:
Mingoose wrote:


Being nice is absolutely a moral imperative.


+1


Do we really need another Turn 16 Foul thread??

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Mingoose



Joined: Jul 28, 2016

Post   Posted: Jun 29, 2023 - 22:43 Reply with quote Back to top

mekutata wrote:
RDaneel wrote:
Mingoose wrote:


Being nice is absolutely a moral imperative.


+1


Do we really need another Turn 16 Foul thread??


Being nice is not an imperative in the Blood Bowl universe. Mayhem is the imperative there.
Gridironman



Joined: Mar 18, 2022

Post   Posted: Jun 30, 2023 - 01:00 Reply with quote Back to top

Generally speaking, if you stream games within a league you will need to ask consent from all the participants being featured. As a personal rule I did not provide the actual name or even handle of the participants playing. I would be vague and say that this is a good coach to learn from or that was a bad choice. It allowed me to be more incisive because you may drive people away from the game if you name them and they have a bad outing. It is not good to name the players that do well by name either because there will be bad dice games eventually.

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An Amorican Nuffler that bashed in his youth.
Gridironman



Joined: Mar 18, 2022

Post   Posted: Jun 30, 2023 - 01:04 Reply with quote Back to top

I would say that turn 16 fouling is okay within a league but wrong in competitive because they are trying to build a team and will not have any bearing on your team's success. Although it makes a statement and not a move that many people like--fouling on turn 16 within a league has a function--it makes the other team weaker and that is important if you need to surpass them in the final standings. Pragmatically, fouling someone outside of your division/conference on turn 16 may give your division mates an easier road to the playoffs. In general, turn 16 fouling is a rude thing to do, but mostly only accepted in a league match.

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An Amorican Nuffler that bashed in his youth.
koadah



Joined: Mar 30, 2005

Post   Posted: Jun 30, 2023 - 02:07 Reply with quote Back to top

Gridironman wrote:
I would say that turn 16 fouling is okay within a league but wrong in competitive because they are trying to build a team and will not have any bearing on your team's success.


What? It is the [C]ompetitive division! It is not for cry babies. Twisted Evil

It is your duty to ensure that the division is properly competitive. There are trophies at stake!

Rookies can always start at 145 Mr. Green

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O[L]C 2016 Swiss! ----- All Stars - Anniversary Bowl - Teams of Stars - 13th March
Gridironman



Joined: Mar 18, 2022

Post   Posted: Jun 30, 2023 - 04:57 Reply with quote Back to top

My point of view is that there is no net gain on the turn 16 foul in competitive, but there is a net gain within league play.

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An Amorican Nuffler that bashed in his youth.
MerryZ



Joined: Nov 28, 2005

Post   Posted: Jun 30, 2023 - 06:08 Reply with quote Back to top

You gain enjoyment from turn 16 fouls.

What else would you want to gain from a game ?

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Ridik700



Joined: Feb 11, 2023

Post   Posted: Jun 30, 2023 - 07:55 Reply with quote Back to top

I don't know why you wouldn't foul on T16 - there is no downside if you do it after anything else that you can do that might be more useful
but this is off topic
RDaneel



Joined: Feb 24, 2023

Post   Posted: Jun 30, 2023 - 09:17 Reply with quote Back to top

Being nice is not related making or not foul IMO

Being nice for me is linked on the coach communication attitude: how he behaves in chat or in his streaming channel . (f.i there are coaches who don t say a word during the whole match played hard . Neither a good game. Neither a “gratz” if you score.. Then they take a definitive TD at turn16 they lose the match and they start criticism your holy luck telling you something like “you played bad and you did impossible dice rolls at the end and you even won ! What a shame” or whining about dicing or rules whatever. Well this is not being nice for instance. If you don’t want to speak in the chat shut up yourself during the whole match . And not that you become sarcastic or arrogant chatter if you lose: this is not being nice.

If someone during his streaming make personal attacks or spoke bad about FUMBBL community: This is not being nice.
You can play in total competitive way (doing fouls, making timeout without mercy in competitive I can understand even if you know my opinion on warnings anyway ) but you can play hard and also being nice (by respecting your opponent as human being or show some “empathy” as you play with a person and not vs an AI) .

So yes: it is possible to play in very competitive hard way and at the same time being also nice, polite and gentleman.
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