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2013-10-30 14:05:29
12 votes, rating 4.3
12 votes, rating 4.3
Opponents coaching............
Over the course of my short time in the FUMBBL world there have been ups and downs....! Nuffle has spanked me on several occasions.(As is his prerogative!) You roll 1's when you need 2+, you trip and die. You lose games where you have rushed more, blocked more, inflicted more casualties, earned more SPP's......
You laugh, you cry, there is friendly banter and jokes and the result of the game becomes secondary to the spirit of BB!
But.........(and you knew it was coming!) The opponent who questions your decisions, to me, that is the biggest sin in the game. Now I am not talking about the friendly nudge to the beginner, the laugh, the joke about a mistimed blitz, a misclick or the overlook of an obvious play when you are tired.
I am highlighting the almost aggressive, patronising, unsportsmanlike comment along the lines of "why didn't you XYZ?" "you could have XYZ!!" It is in a way, an insult. Are you suggesting you are a better coach? Are you suggesting that you know what I am trying to achieve? Are you suggesting that you are so much better than me (and you may be but do you need to point it out?)that the only sane move would be the one that I didn't make? Are you suggesting that you know better than me?
This isn't a blog about who knows best. This is about letting coaches play the game the way they want to play it. They may have a fun team with players that can only "behave" in certain ways......etc. They may want to try something different, experimental, they may want to follow a game plan that you are unable to fathom, they may just be a terrible coach.
Whatever they are and whatever they decide...respect their decision. Laugh, be friendly, have fun but let your opponent play the way they want to play.........whether that is up to your standards or not is irrelevant!
You laugh, you cry, there is friendly banter and jokes and the result of the game becomes secondary to the spirit of BB!
But.........(and you knew it was coming!) The opponent who questions your decisions, to me, that is the biggest sin in the game. Now I am not talking about the friendly nudge to the beginner, the laugh, the joke about a mistimed blitz, a misclick or the overlook of an obvious play when you are tired.
I am highlighting the almost aggressive, patronising, unsportsmanlike comment along the lines of "why didn't you XYZ?" "you could have XYZ!!" It is in a way, an insult. Are you suggesting you are a better coach? Are you suggesting that you know what I am trying to achieve? Are you suggesting that you are so much better than me (and you may be but do you need to point it out?)that the only sane move would be the one that I didn't make? Are you suggesting that you know better than me?
This isn't a blog about who knows best. This is about letting coaches play the game the way they want to play it. They may have a fun team with players that can only "behave" in certain ways......etc. They may want to try something different, experimental, they may want to follow a game plan that you are unable to fathom, they may just be a terrible coach.
Whatever they are and whatever they decide...respect their decision. Laugh, be friendly, have fun but let your opponent play the way they want to play.........whether that is up to your standards or not is irrelevant!
Comments
Posted by Overhamsteren on 2013-10-30 14:12:13
Why didn't you make a less whiny post, that would have been much better.
;)
;)
Posted by Verminardo on 2013-10-30 14:30:23
I agree that it's patronizing (unless asked for), and furthermore, you post serves to illustrate also that it is most often not appreciated, even if well intended. I for my part do appreciate it when a better coach points something out to me.
Posted by Chainsaw on 2013-10-30 14:31:23
Why didn't you learn how to play better? Then we wouldn't have to be patronising you.
Posted by PurpleChest on 2013-10-30 14:37:53
at 87 games played, i wouldnt be offering advice unless asked.
at 27 i might. Might he/she have been trying to be helpful? Did you aks them politely to stop?
at 27 i might. Might he/she have been trying to be helpful? Did you aks them politely to stop?
Posted by viperstrike77 on 2013-10-30 14:54:27
I have to add that this hasn't happened to me Purple.... I have seen it several times whilst speculating and watched the chat between coaches deteriorate.
Chainsaw : lol :)
Overhamsteren : nice! ;)
Chainsaw : lol :)
Overhamsteren : nice! ;)
Posted by keggiemckill on 2013-10-30 14:56:04
I hate when people do this during a game. It's very demeaning. I never give advice to coaches unless they are new comers. The other thing is that I avoid playing new to Fumbbl coaches. I don't want to be seen as a dirty rat piker who preys on the weak. Of I end up playing someone new on Box, I defer them to Kodahs 145 club. If you feel impelled to give advice, try asking your opponent if they would like some Criticism. Otherwise Play the game, Joke about your fails, Kill all menz.
Posted by harvestmouse on 2013-10-30 15:37:01
I agree with this in principle. Where coaches do demean others for their play. However the 2 examples given "why didn't you XYZ?" "you could have XYZ!!" I don't think are.
Certainly I've done these in situations, and I see both of these examples as giving advice in a situation where your opponent clearly made a mistake.
The fact 'Could have' (which is very polite) or to question an obvious mistake instead of saying you made a mistake, I see both of these as polite ways of trying to improve your opponents game. Which is a selfless act.
All said though, you shouldn't be critical of more than 2 points of your opponents game. Any more than 2 will be hard to take in, and demoralising.
Certainly I've done these in situations, and I see both of these examples as giving advice in a situation where your opponent clearly made a mistake.
The fact 'Could have' (which is very polite) or to question an obvious mistake instead of saying you made a mistake, I see both of these as polite ways of trying to improve your opponents game. Which is a selfless act.
All said though, you shouldn't be critical of more than 2 points of your opponents game. Any more than 2 will be hard to take in, and demoralising.
Posted by Topper on 2013-10-30 16:01:38
I like to give advice - and do so only to improve my opponents play. I always ask, and do it only if there´s a good atmosphere.
But isn´t "Would it be okay if I gave yo an advice" just as "moralizing" as saying "Why did you do that"?
Also a question like "Why did you do that" doesn´t have to be negatively or demeaning - it could be just what it reads - a question of someone trying to understand. To understand the thinking of what happened in the other guys head. Also if you are a speaker - it´s rare you have specced from start till end, and thus have no idea what they have agreed on prior. True? Is for me at least!
But isn´t "Would it be okay if I gave yo an advice" just as "moralizing" as saying "Why did you do that"?
Also a question like "Why did you do that" doesn´t have to be negatively or demeaning - it could be just what it reads - a question of someone trying to understand. To understand the thinking of what happened in the other guys head. Also if you are a speaker - it´s rare you have specced from start till end, and thus have no idea what they have agreed on prior. True? Is for me at least!
Posted by Malmir on 2013-10-30 18:18:06
The last time I gave advice was a couple of months ago. He had asked me early on to do so and I checked again before I pointed out three or four things he could have done differently. Despite this the tone became frosty for the rest of the match. So giving advice in my opinion is best avoided even if they think they want it.
Posted by Seventyone on 2013-10-30 19:19:46
Personally I love getting advice. It hasn't helped much though...
Posted by pythrr on 2013-10-30 19:36:37
meh, yr opponent can say whatever the hell they like - that is their right.
and you can ignore them, argue with them, or call them a tool - that is your right.
and you can ignore them, argue with them, or call them a tool - that is your right.
Posted by Synn on 2013-10-30 20:08:21
Generally I don't provide advice because I do not want to appear patronizing. That being said, I have recently had a spate of games where the other coach asked for it and I was more than happy to provide.
Posted by Jeffro on 2013-10-30 21:01:52
I like saying "Why didn't you roll a 6 there?"
"So much better for you if you didn't roll 1's..."
"Have you tried not sucking?"
"Use my dice. Yours hate you."
"Maybe if you didn't molest children, you'd do better."
... at least that's what I say when I play Brasky.
"So much better for you if you didn't roll 1's..."
"Have you tried not sucking?"
"Use my dice. Yours hate you."
"Maybe if you didn't molest children, you'd do better."
... at least that's what I say when I play Brasky.
Posted by Stimme on 2013-10-30 22:19:59
I agree with harvestmouse and Malmir. When playing an unknown coach, it most of the times is pretty much impossible to point out some potentially better plays without creating a frosty environment. Asking whether it is okay to advice or comment makes it just more awkward.
It's just another example that lots of typical human social interactions don't work if you can't see the other person's face or hear his tone.
It's just another example that lots of typical human social interactions don't work if you can't see the other person's face or hear his tone.