45 coaches online • Server time: 23:20
* * * Did you know? The best interceptor is Leena with 22 interceptions.
Recent Forum Topics  NBFL Season 32: The ... | Gnomes are trash | FUMBBL HAIKU'S |
2011-04-08 13:44:52
42 votes, rating 3.7
42 votes, rating 3.7
Slow Playing
Lately I ve had to play against several slow players and there is nothing more boring than having to play against an oppo who takes 4 min per turn. It is ok if you do it in one or two turns because that turns may be crucial for the rest of the half; but there are coaches that take time to think EVERY single move. I ve seen coaches taking more than 1 min to think to which of the 3 squares they will push your player and in situations where it doesn’t make any different. I ve seen coaches taking time once they have already pushed ur player as if by taking time they would increase the probability of causing an injury. I ve seen players taking 1 minute after they roll a double skull just to show u how unlucky they were. I ve seen coaches taking 4 min in turns in which all ur players are on the floor and his ballcarrier is totally safe. I cannot understand how someone can take 4 min in this situation. Things can be worse if you are getting really unlucky and ur turns finish after the first move. Then you have been waiting 4 or more min to start with ur turn, then ur turn finishes in one second and you know that u ll have to wait 4 min until the next turn, this situation is really horrible.
I like blood bowl when I play and I like it when my opo plays. I think it is important to watch ur opo’s game if you want to play properly. But when ur opo is really slow you start doing other thing like watching a movie, making dinner or whatever and you don’t play as you would play against a normal opo that is possible to watch his game. Therefore you are paying less attention against an opponent that is thinking deeply every single movement. Moreover one thing I ve realized is that there is not a connection between being a slow coach and being a bad coach.
Normally slow players justify their slowness by saying that they only enjoy the game when they think in their moves. I wanted to say that not every turn requires a deep thinking and that taking 4 min per turn is a lack of respect. Slow coaches should consider that they are not playing alone and that you ll never play the real game if ur slowness makes ur rivals to pay less attention. I just wanted to say that slow players should understand that the game is funnier when u play fast, fast doesn’t mean without thinking, fast means a game style that allow ur oppo to watch ur game without doing other things. In fact you realize that playing faster makes the game funnier. I cannot explain why playing fast makes the game funnier but it really does.
This is a message to all slow players that think that playing slow makes the game better I just wanted to encourage them to try to play faster.
I like blood bowl when I play and I like it when my opo plays. I think it is important to watch ur opo’s game if you want to play properly. But when ur opo is really slow you start doing other thing like watching a movie, making dinner or whatever and you don’t play as you would play against a normal opo that is possible to watch his game. Therefore you are paying less attention against an opponent that is thinking deeply every single movement. Moreover one thing I ve realized is that there is not a connection between being a slow coach and being a bad coach.
Normally slow players justify their slowness by saying that they only enjoy the game when they think in their moves. I wanted to say that not every turn requires a deep thinking and that taking 4 min per turn is a lack of respect. Slow coaches should consider that they are not playing alone and that you ll never play the real game if ur slowness makes ur rivals to pay less attention. I just wanted to say that slow players should understand that the game is funnier when u play fast, fast doesn’t mean without thinking, fast means a game style that allow ur oppo to watch ur game without doing other things. In fact you realize that playing faster makes the game funnier. I cannot explain why playing fast makes the game funnier but it really does.
This is a message to all slow players that think that playing slow makes the game better I just wanted to encourage them to try to play faster.
Comments
Posted by maysrill on 2011-04-08 14:34:19
You'll get no arguments from me on this one. A "long" turn for me goes over 2 minutes. Most of mine are in the 30-90 second range (and yes, I pay attention to it, as I take some pride in keeping my games to a brisk pace).
To those who are bad at math, new to the game, or just like to think things through: so be it. But I won't contribute to this problem, and I may be less likely to play you in Ranked if I know you are so slow (nothing personal, but I'd like to play about 40% of the time of the game at least, not 20%, and ideally about 50%)
To those who are bad at math, new to the game, or just like to think things through: so be it. But I won't contribute to this problem, and I may be less likely to play you in Ranked if I know you are so slow (nothing personal, but I'd like to play about 40% of the time of the game at least, not 20%, and ideally about 50%)
Posted by Grod on 2011-04-08 14:44:01
That is one nice thing about Cyanide: optional 2 minute turn limit games.
I get into trouble with my wife sometimes because I start a game that takes longer than it should, and runs into dinner time or something. An option for quicker games is nice.
Also, I think some of the help in FFC, like displaying block dice etc, can actually slow some coaches down, as they click on every player just to see how many block dice each has, rather than quickly evaluating it for themselves.
I get into trouble with my wife sometimes because I start a game that takes longer than it should, and runs into dinner time or something. An option for quicker games is nice.
Also, I think some of the help in FFC, like displaying block dice etc, can actually slow some coaches down, as they click on every player just to see how many block dice each has, rather than quickly evaluating it for themselves.
Posted by Garion on 2011-04-08 14:46:14
well said, connection issues aside and interuptions like phone calls etc aside, there is no reason a turn should ever take more than 2 minutes. Most of mine are between 1 minute and a 1 and half minutes. and it bugs the hell out of me too when my opponents are taking 4 minutes every turn even when there is nothing to do.
This is also especially true in the new client which works out all the rolls for you. It often feels like I am playing for 20 minutes and my opponent is playing for 40.
This is also especially true in the new client which works out all the rolls for you. It often feels like I am playing for 20 minutes and my opponent is playing for 40.
Posted by ultwe on 2011-04-08 15:01:35
Nope
Posted by JimmyFantastic on 2011-04-08 15:02:14
9000/6
Posted by DonTomaso on 2011-04-08 17:13:09
Agreed.
That's why God has granted us the Time Out-button...
But still 4 minutes is calculated from when you have to move EVERYTHING (incl turn marker, goals, etc.) yourself. On Fumbbl, where you hardly have to think, 3 minutes is plenty.
That's why God has granted us the Time Out-button...
But still 4 minutes is calculated from when you have to move EVERYTHING (incl turn marker, goals, etc.) yourself. On Fumbbl, where you hardly have to think, 3 minutes is plenty.
Posted by fly on 2011-04-08 20:10:25
can't wait for the sfc league in the congregation to start again. turn time limit:
1 minute.
1 minute.
Posted by Keith-Lemon on 2011-04-08 21:45:26
Im playing a game now and im bored to death, Not playing as well as i normaly play because im not watching the game any more as he takes so long.
Posted by koadah on 2011-04-08 22:56:22
That's the great thing about Cyanide. You can pick a 4 min game (3 was ideal) and don't have to listen to the moaners. :)
Posted by pythrr on 2011-04-09 08:29:46
maybe they are just very very stoned.
oh, and koadah. don't talk crap: there is nothing great about Cyanide.
oh, and koadah. don't talk crap: there is nothing great about Cyanide.
Posted by SillySod on 2011-04-09 16:46:13
Each coach is given 4 minutes each turn.
There is absolutely nothing wrong with them using those 4 minutes.
(well, as long as they are actually using the minutes to think/do... I'm not arguing in favour of those guys that spend three minutes wanking before walking in a touchdown)
There is absolutely nothing wrong with them using those 4 minutes.
(well, as long as they are actually using the minutes to think/do... I'm not arguing in favour of those guys that spend three minutes wanking before walking in a touchdown)
Posted by PorkSol on 2011-04-09 21:22:45
It would be really nice if they lowered the time limit to 3 minutes.
4 minutes may be needed in tabletop where you need to manually roll dice and calculate success or failure, ball scatter and so on.
But with it all done automatically on FFB, 4 minutes is more time than anyone should need.
Although it's kind of an effective strategy as I play terrible against the super slow players as I don't watch their turns.
4 minutes may be needed in tabletop where you need to manually roll dice and calculate success or failure, ball scatter and so on.
But with it all done automatically on FFB, 4 minutes is more time than anyone should need.
Although it's kind of an effective strategy as I play terrible against the super slow players as I don't watch their turns.
Posted by Naru1981 on 2011-04-09 22:13:20
Woodstock takes 4 mins. but to be fair thats per GAME not per turn lol.
i have found that telling ppl they are playing quite slow helps. most feel embarresed and get quicker
i have found that telling ppl they are playing quite slow helps. most feel embarresed and get quicker
Posted by shadow46x2 on 2011-04-11 06:23:36
LRB6 specifically states 4 minutes per turn...
additionally...for a non-overtime game, 1 coach taking 4 minutes per turn, for 16 turns is 64 minutes...if you take 1 minute per turn, which is reasonable for a coach who is comfortable with their tactics, that is an 80 minute match, excluding inducement & kickoff time...
taken one step further...most coaches who take too long, do not take the full 4 minutes, but take somewhere between 3-4 minutes...which drops the match length down from 80 minutes(+ setup time)....
fumbbl rules require you to allow 90 minutes for a match....
....i fail to see the problem here...
additionally...for a non-overtime game, 1 coach taking 4 minutes per turn, for 16 turns is 64 minutes...if you take 1 minute per turn, which is reasonable for a coach who is comfortable with their tactics, that is an 80 minute match, excluding inducement & kickoff time...
taken one step further...most coaches who take too long, do not take the full 4 minutes, but take somewhere between 3-4 minutes...which drops the match length down from 80 minutes(+ setup time)....
fumbbl rules require you to allow 90 minutes for a match....
....i fail to see the problem here...
Posted by srjuanone on 2011-04-11 17:09:04
Hi shadow,
-The facts:
1. There are coaches that think that playing slow makes the game funnier.
2. I cannot enjoy a game if my opponent takes 4 minutes every turn
a. I cannot watch how my oppo plays
b. I get distracted
c. Sometimes is really maddening
-The problem:
As you can see there are two opposing views of how to play the game in order to have fun.
-The one with the problem:
I don’t think slow coaches have problems facing normal coaches…
-Ideal world:
The two players have fun.
- My opinion:
I think slow players are wrong when they think that playing slowly makes the game better. I think that playing fast adds something to the game. You have to think ur tactics but u have to do it fast and in a heuristic way and not like a robot. Top chess players when they make a move they don’t calculate all the consequences and possible outcomes of that move (this is done by the computers). Humans have a heuristic way of thinking… you haven’t calculated all the possible implications of ur move, however you know that it is good to make it. This is how I think blood bowl should be played if you want to have fun. Taken one step further… when the game is playing quickly and heuristically is like a dynamic game and you feel that the pixel are really playing blood bowl.
-How the solve the problem:
I didn’t say anything about changing the rules. I just wanted to show slow players how I feel and how I play when I face them, because I thought this may change the way they play. When I face a slow player, at the end of the game, I always told him that I didn’t enjoy the game because of his slowness and nobody tell me: “it is not my problem, LRB6 specifically states 4 minutes per turn”; however they say that they will try to play faster in the future.
-The facts:
1. There are coaches that think that playing slow makes the game funnier.
2. I cannot enjoy a game if my opponent takes 4 minutes every turn
a. I cannot watch how my oppo plays
b. I get distracted
c. Sometimes is really maddening
-The problem:
As you can see there are two opposing views of how to play the game in order to have fun.
-The one with the problem:
I don’t think slow coaches have problems facing normal coaches…
-Ideal world:
The two players have fun.
- My opinion:
I think slow players are wrong when they think that playing slowly makes the game better. I think that playing fast adds something to the game. You have to think ur tactics but u have to do it fast and in a heuristic way and not like a robot. Top chess players when they make a move they don’t calculate all the consequences and possible outcomes of that move (this is done by the computers). Humans have a heuristic way of thinking… you haven’t calculated all the possible implications of ur move, however you know that it is good to make it. This is how I think blood bowl should be played if you want to have fun. Taken one step further… when the game is playing quickly and heuristically is like a dynamic game and you feel that the pixel are really playing blood bowl.
-How the solve the problem:
I didn’t say anything about changing the rules. I just wanted to show slow players how I feel and how I play when I face them, because I thought this may change the way they play. When I face a slow player, at the end of the game, I always told him that I didn’t enjoy the game because of his slowness and nobody tell me: “it is not my problem, LRB6 specifically states 4 minutes per turn”; however they say that they will try to play faster in the future.