Posted by p4m on 2013-05-03 04:33:10

my 2 cents: to pull a naama with a complete team is just showing disrespect to your opponent, laughing right in his face and just mocking him...

getting ssp just by doing cas is a valid option but just to maim him... well that is just showoff and i hope Nuffle will get you next game...

Posted by garyt1 on 2013-05-03 05:16:55

From the report I would say both were probably being asses at times but Fangbanger just skipping turns in a major was asking for trouble.

Posted by DustBunny on 2013-05-03 05:21:59

Skipping turns with that many players on the field is pretty disrespectful to your opponent, and i'd go so far as to say it could be a rules violation to do with in game agreements.

It's also worth mentioning that he had 6 elves to field in OT. The game played afterwards where xnoelx was forced to play OT with a rookie beastman and a CW had a bigger dicing occurring, but a coach with a better sense of humour and competitive spirit was on the recieving end.

Posted by pythrr on 2013-05-03 05:57:52

funny. as. hell.

Posted by pythrr on 2013-05-03 06:00:28

tbh, a pity that the hall of fame died

also a pity that Wuhan turned into a pussy.

Posted by Mihme on 2013-05-03 06:52:17

Naama is finnish word what means face and there is saying (sombody is) naamat, what means (sombody is) totally wasted. Dunnow does this have anything to do with this Fumbbl saying Naama

Posted by oryx on 2013-05-03 07:33:37

Sounds like Naama to me! Just take a look at his profile pic =D

Posted by Malmir on 2013-05-03 07:39:25

Very poor sportsmanship in my opinion.

Posted by Stonetroll on 2013-05-03 09:11:21

I wish I was cool enough to pull a naama in a tournament. In LRB4 times seeing those filthy pickers get scheduled against him was always hilarious, because he would take every opportunity to kill their precious pixels. :)

Posted by BooAhl on 2013-05-03 10:08:50

http://fumbbl.com/FUMBBL.php?page=match&op=view&id=1322958

That last turn, it was epic...

Posted by j0de on 2013-05-03 10:29:10

You just earned the 2nd spot in my whitelist for this! \o/

Posted by easilyamused on 2013-05-03 10:45:36

Oh dear, looks like someone is getting banned from tourneys for a while.....

Posted by PurpleChest on 2013-05-03 10:48:08

All coaches are reminded that in Official FUMBBL Tournaments you are expected to play competitively and to try to win the game.

Posted by easilyamused on 2013-05-03 10:48:59

Plus, even if you were prominsed donations to the site for doing it, purposefully trying to maim a team is a complete douche move. Just win the damn game and get over yourself.

Games like this show that there is no point in whining about the dice after 4 turns, they always even out in the end and you look like a fool. And you have the added bonus of ruining the game for your opponent.

Posted by Chainsaw on 2013-05-03 11:00:34

You are not easily amused.

Posted by Calcium on 2013-05-03 11:13:51

Loving the Pythrr quote at the end of Naama's coach profile, I struggle to imagine Pythrr having any 'serious' moments here :)

How have I never played Namma?

Posted by Shraaaag on 2013-05-03 11:19:57

There's a FUMBBL Hall of Fame?

Posted by Kam on 2013-05-03 11:23:13

Well his opponent didn't really try to win the game...

What about handing off the ball to a player on the td line instead of walking through for instance?

I left after the 1st half - I wish I would have stayed. :)

Posted by Mr_Foulscumm on 2013-05-03 11:33:52

Chainsaw, dude, that wasn't cool.

If he had been trying to still win, then it could be fun. But doing this vs someone that has clearly thrown in the towel? Weak.

Although it is fun when coaches brag about stuff that they really should be ashamed of. :)

Posted by Qaz on 2013-05-03 12:04:25

Naama was a bag of FUN! still wish he was still active.

Posted by Ullakkomorko on 2013-05-03 12:52:56

Didn't see the game so I won't go there. But Chainsaw trying to score internet-points by continuing this in a blog is just sad.

Posted by Purplegoo on 2013-05-03 13:02:31

Dear oh dear. There really is no hope for some people.

Posted by PainState on 2013-05-03 15:21:09

"Oh dear, looks like someone is getting banned from tourneys for a while....." (easilyamused)

"All coaches are reminded that in Official FUMBBL Tournaments you are expected to play competitively and to try to win the game." (PurpleChest, High Lord of Majors)


Well this is interesting. The question is did one or both coaches violate majors rules?


It is very obvious that chainsaw is walking the fine line of "sportsmanship" like he is taking a field sobriety test after 30 beers.

Posted by easilyamused on 2013-05-03 15:43:56

My comment was aimed at the concession as these are strictly against Tournament rules.

As far as I can tell Chainsaw hasn't broken any rules.

Unless.

Was a score refused to deliveratly take the game to OT with the sole purpose of inflicting damage to the other team? You could argue that this is not within the "spirit" of the game and hence against Tournament rules.

At the end of the day its probably safe to say that Chainsaw played to win in OT. He may not have done it the gentlemanly way or with any consideration for his opponent (can you say social game anyone?) but he got the win.

Neither coach has covered themselves in glory here.

Posted by easilyamused on 2013-05-03 15:46:39

I think the key point in the tournament rules is to play within the spirit of the tournament.

Seeing as it is the GLT you could argue that Chainsaw has done exactly that.

And I just died a little inside.....

Posted by Mr_Foulscumm on 2013-05-03 15:52:19

Chainsaw blitzed backwards with the Wolf towards the end of the 2nd half. And since there were like 4 turns without any opposition. A score in regulation was more than possible. It was like he was playing on a cleared pitch.

Posted by PainState on 2013-05-03 15:57:38

I hear what you are saying

BUT

concessions in majors is really also about spirit of the game type stuff also. "we" dont want guys conceeding in majors because of its effects downt he road so to speak. Plus concessions are just lame. But we have also loosly defined legal concessions on the sight also.


But in defense of Fangbangers concession. He did it in OT. Also Chainsaw performed a perfect naama. Which if perfectly executed is a plan to make your opponeet conceed. So do we need to ban the Naama tactic because it promotes concessions?

So who really was in the wrong? No body IMO. It was just a classic match of Blood Bowl where one coach goes over the top to kick dirt in the other guys face and the other coach leaves the dug out with waded up panties. What is the issue again? Dont give me the bland well the rules state......BS.

What really is the issue here? Because this specific case seems to have be building up some undercurrents of other issues not related to the black/white the rules state this answer.

So for clarity

I have no issue with Chainsaw doing what he did. I question how he is reacting after the match really.

I have no issue with Fangbangers response to chainsaw puroposly taking the match to OT just to kick dirt in his face.

Posted by C3I2 on 2013-05-03 16:16:16

Its not like we can see the ingame chatt in the Replay; but somehow I doubt this is a tactical choice to get some extra money and one extra MVP. Probably has a lot more with what happened early in the game then anything else.

Posted by easilyamused on 2013-05-03 16:19:59

I agree with you PainState. I dont blame fangbanger for the concession and Chainsaw got the win so he played to win eventually.

This whole debate started because someone decided to brag about on pitch shenanigans without actually bragging. And it was done in such an unsubtle way that people have jumped all over it :)

To sum up. Chainsaw is a douche for pulling a namaa, fangbanger is a douche for conceeding in a major. I'm a douche for quoting tournament rules and everyone else on the site is to one extent or other a douche aswell.

Oh the joys of the interwebz :)

Now whens the next GLT match?

Posted by the_Sage on 2013-05-03 16:28:42

Actually, getting extra cas in overtime might get you that skill that wins you the tourney, so there is even an argument to be made for it from a competitive point of view.

TRULY humiliating the opponent would be to win the overtime toss, then choose to kick. =D

Posted by Chainsaw on 2013-05-03 16:37:13

Fun comments.

For anybody still reading... I've had it suggested to me that I should have (having won the toss) elected to kick. Now *that* would be a 'perfect naama', no?

Posted by C3I2 on 2013-05-03 16:44:53

Hardly, but I guess you would not have tried vs a Wood Elf player with a one turner left on the team.

Now, what about retiring #7 Lion's Roar; you know you want to!

Posted by xnoelx on 2013-05-03 16:47:24

No-one seems to have mentioned clicking through turns without any action, at a point when the game wasn't definitively over. That seems the worst thing done by either coach to me. And I have to say I'd be tempted to Naama anyone that did that (although I doubt I would). But I definitely would carry on blocking and fouling, with the hope of causing damage.

Posted by PainState on 2013-05-03 16:51:49

"Actually, getting extra cas in overtime might get you that skill that wins you the tourney, so there is even an argument to be made for it from a competitive point of view." (the-sage)

Well lets sidetrack this for a minute based on this comment.

It was stated that Fangbanger was lame for not standing up his players.

Then sage says you could say it is competitive to take the match to OT to farm more SPP from his opponeet via the CAS. Now if your opponeet is also competitve. He does not want to give you free SPP he lays his guys down. Counter tactic to your competitve farm SPP CAS plan. So how could you say the guy laying down is not being competitive?

You could also see the coach who is next in line to play that coach who is trying to farm free SPP from CAS screaming in chat for the other coach to lay down and not let him get anymore free SPP. He to is being competitve.


So how is laying down pixels when you are getting beaten down to a bloody pulp not competitive again? Is that not a valid competitive tactic to avoid handing out free spp?

In fact laying down early in a half presents the other coach only one option to get free spp...SCORE! but alas that means the other guy might have a chance on the reset and most coaches it seems dont like giving the other coach a chance to actually "play". They just want to farm easy SPP.


Bottom line: Laying down pixels late in a match to avoid handing out easy CAS SPP is competitive in itself also, even though it means you lose.

Posted by C3I2 on 2013-05-03 16:52:30

Actually xnoelx, that just sound stupid, for a tournament game.

The correct reason not to stand up your players is to reduce damage (done by a mb/po guy for example) and only allowing fouls to be made. That would mean, you also dodge away with the guys still standing up.

Posted by xnoelx on 2013-05-03 17:02:47

Er, what? C312, I think you misunderstand. I'm not suggesting taking no action. That's what happened.

Reducing damage and denying SPP is all well and good, but only applies in the direst, can't possibly win situation. When you could still go for the tie/win, as in the game being discussed, taking no action is a complete nonsense, and in no way can be termed competitive.

Posted by PainState on 2013-05-03 17:09:29

"For anybody still reading... I've had it suggested to me that I should have (having won the toss) elected to kick. Now *that* would be a 'perfect naama', no?" (chainsaw"

Well you did miss your chance for fame sir. This was a win/win for you.

You kick and still win you perform a perfect Naama and feel good about it.

You kick and lose, well you go into the hall of fame right under Naama. It is called performing a Chainsaw....a screwed up naama that costs you a match...perfect chainsaw award is given if you do it in a major...a godly chainsaw award if you do it in the main draw of a major and the bonhead of stupidity chainsaw award if you do it in the finals of a major.


So a win/win chance at greatness....BLOWN.

Sidenote: If you want a trully competitve naama match. They you should elect to kick in OT. Because you opponeet is going to be so pissed off he will be head hunting. And what is more competitive that a great Blood Bowl smack down of two teams head hunting and going for some serious CAS. Plus your opponeet cannot say he did not have a chance in the end to win the match. It diffuses the emotional side of the naama to a certain extent from your opponeet.

Posted by PainState on 2013-05-03 17:18:37

"Reducing damage and denying SPP is all well and good, but only applies in the direst, can't possibly win situation. When you could still go for the tie/win, as in the game being discussed, taking no action is a complete nonsense, and in no way can be termed competitive" (xnoelx)

The problem with this statement is that it ignores human nature completly.

The psychological side of this game cannot be ignored. Sometimes one coach gets the upperhand to the point that his opponeet litteraly "checks out". It could be because of a percieved "dicing" going on or the other coach is just overwhelmed by tactics.

That coach "believes" he has no chance and goes into a shell to preserve his team OR he is emotionally upset that he has litterally just quit. And since you cant conceed under most situations thay just lay down and click out.

Now the coach who is winning this type of match. Could you not say his plans for victory worked out to its best possible result? Your plan forced your opponeet to litterally quit?


Coming back and saying well you could have tried to roll this many dice and if they all came up good you still have a chance just does not "fly" with a guy who believes he has allready lost. You cannot convince him he had some mystical .05% chance to win the match. That coach has allready "checked out" and is getting ready for his next match or penning his rage quit blog.

Posted by xnoelx on 2013-05-03 17:31:50

I wouldn't say my statement ignores human nature. But to-may-to, to-mah-to...
It was obvious why turns were being clicked through, so I didn't need to get into a discussion about why it happened and the complexities of the human psyche to draw the conclusion that, whatever the motives, the decision made at that point was the worst possible one.
And I'm not trying to convince the coach in question he had a good chance at winning (although any chance is enough), just wondering why the naama/concession are getting all the attention/discussion, instead of the clicking through turns, which was, to me, the most heinous part of the situation.

Posted by Ullakkomorko on 2013-05-03 17:33:04

You can't argue that someone is/was playing to win if they actually won in the end. Chainsaw was taking a mind boggling risk by going into overtime against elves.

Posted by Calcium on 2013-05-03 17:35:59

Wow. Just WOW.

All this debate is good for the soul :)

Posted by pythrr on 2013-05-03 17:37:41

rather lame from all concerned.

but it is a victimless crime, a lot like two scumbags shooting each other in an alley. who really cares?

Posted by Calcium on 2013-05-03 17:57:38

NUFFLE cares Pythrr. NUFFLE cares for us all x

Posted by happygrue on 2013-05-03 18:02:41

@PainState: There is still time to induct ... to my mind, "Pulling Chainsaw" now means to justify your pride in doing something shameful with an even more shameful reason. For example: "subtly" blogging about Pulling a Naama FOR MONEY.

A Perfect Chainsaw would be then to delete the blog at some later date. :D

Granted, clicking through turns in a major - let alone conceding - is shameful and against the rules (and something that can/will be punished). What's genius about pulling a Chainsaw is that it isn't against the rules. You get off for free! \o/

Posted by Mr_Foulscumm on 2013-05-03 19:16:42

I like happygrues idea.
-----

Pulling a Chainsaw (Noun)

definition:

"Taking pride in something shameful because it is done for money"

-----

So can we add it to the Fumbbl dictionary? :D

Posted by garyt1 on 2013-05-03 22:17:06

Is their a phrase for keeping players down and repeatedly clicking end turn?
Pulling a Fangbanger?

Posted by pythrr on 2013-05-04 00:25:08

^^

Fangbanger is hardly the first to have done this....

Posted by DustBunny on 2013-05-04 01:00:14

I think it's worth noticing that fangbanger didn't simply click through turns with a few players prone to avoid damage. He left his players standing up. In tacklezones. He didn't even dodge away, he had a shot at a 1db on the ball if he tried. But no, he clicked turn. And judging from his comments at the end of the game he was relying on Chainsaw acknowledging some tacit agreement that by clicking turn he would not attempt to get at the ball, or continue to take actions in anyway. I have specc'd several games where this happens and it disgusts me. Not only is this (in my opinion) a direct violation of fumbbl rules relating to in game agreements, it is also extremely disrespectful to your opponent who has come to a majors match with the intention of competitive play. Even at OT fangbanger could field 6 elves, but he conceded. This was just a case of a coach with a bad attitude and worse sportsmanship trying to weasel out of conceding by standing still and hoping that another coach would play ball and help him break the rules.

Dicings happen, be a sport about it. Dicings happen in majors; look at the games in which xnoelx and I both played robocoyote. We got wiped off the pitch, watch those replays for an idea of how to maintain(what is in my opinion) a competitive and sporting attitude, and to leave your opponent satisfied with the game. xnoelx even went to OT, with a rookie goat and a CW, and he made a good go of it. It was a pleasure to watch, and speaking to both coaches after the game they walked away happy.

Although I might not be the best example of rational I took it to the opposite end of the spectrum and lost an AG5 guard player leaping at a cage singlehandedly :P


tl;dr : Actually watch the game if you think fangbanger was simply "not standing guys up"

Posted by Chainsaw on 2013-05-04 01:44:09

I'm guess I'm in a unique spot.

I don't think I did anything wrong (risking a cup exit should be my risk to take) and, whilst what fangbanger did was against the rules, I don't feel strongly about his actions either. It was all* good fun and isn't that what this site is about?

* except for fangbanger; and he was already not having fun. I don't think the Naama particularly altered his emotional state. I can't speak for him though, that's just my interpretation.

Posted by shadow46x2 on 2013-05-04 01:51:05

relevant forum post is relevant...

https://fumbbl.com/index.php?name=PNphpBB2&file=viewtopic&t=23535

Posted by Jasfmpgh on 2013-05-04 13:20:27

I hope you enjoy having this done to you as much as you enjoyed doing it.. maybe it could happen every time you enter a tourney?

Posted by the_Sage on 2013-05-04 14:27:32

If I were playing in a majors and had 6 elves left after 16 rounds of bashing, and my opponent decided to give me overtime, I would be very grateful. Then after I defeated him I would gloat like there was no tomorrow. =D

Yes, I think choosing to kick would have been amazing. After all, you were willing to voluntarily go into OT with the chance of him winning the toss, therefore you must have had great faith in that drive when kicking. I'd have loved to see him concede after you handed him the ball.

Oh btw, it's not naming and shaming to refer to your own Naama action, unless you mention that your opponent gave up playing when he had 7 elves on the pitch and one in the KO box against 10 necro.

I'm sure you may name yourself for your (in some eyes) shameful behavior in pulling the Naama.

Posted by Foad on 2013-05-04 21:17:35

So what was the end result? They both got banned from tourneys?

Posted by Chainsaw on 2013-05-06 19:01:16

Why would I have been banned, Chavo?