Posted by Uedder on 2016-12-22 17:32:24

It's like John Titor said!

Posted by happygrue on 2016-12-22 17:41:44

Yes, or looked at another way...

https://www.brookings.edu/blog/the-avenue/2016/11/29/another-clinton-trump-divide-high-output-america-vs-low-output-america/

Posted by happygrue on 2016-12-22 17:49:28

Summed up in a very interesting off-the-cuff speech by the governor of California in response to incoming team's stance on climate change and what might happen if they try to stop the majority of citizens and the majority of the economy (and thus it's policy) of our country from staying sane: "We'll launch our own damn satellites".

If we want to think of the parts of the country that voted for Clinton as "small" then it would be wise to consider that the majority of our economy and the majority of our citizens bust also be "small" by the same metric.

https://www.theatlantic.com/notes/2016/12/this-is-what-the-resistance-sounds-like/510899/

Posted by licker on 2016-12-22 18:16:16

Jerry Brown...

Sigh.

Still, if you voted for Trump you voted for legitimizing racism, sexism, and homophobia.

So there's that.

Posted by soranos on 2016-12-22 22:30:33

I don't really see the point of this. It cannot distract from the fact ťhat your president has close to 3 million less votes than the runner-up. And this might become an issue at some point in the next 4 years.Trump is lacking legitimacy. He is the president without the backing of the majority of the population. His election is a proof of the absurdity of the American election process. Democratic principles are seriously in doubt when the candidate that gathers 2% less is declared the winner.

Posted by fidius on 2016-12-22 22:37:38

There are many ways to skin this cat, but I tend to think of it as a divide between those who live and breathe a more natural reality (farming, manufacturing, small business) and those a step or two removed from that reality (big city-livers, finance professionals, lawyers, educrats).

@licker: I am not a Trump fan, but if you believe that, you believe it because the Dems wanted you to. Trump's positions are not inherently racist or ___phobic imo. In fact the election result was primarily a backlash against the "big city" types painting the "earthy" types that way in the first place. Since the election the Left has more or less doubled down on your idea that "if you voted for Trump you're evil", which is the GOP brand Dem politicians have been actively promoting for decades now. If you believe it, you essentially bought what they sold you.

And folks wonder why the election was "divisive".

Posted by Wreckage on 2016-12-22 23:19:47

Wow, the city dwellers with ample information exchange, with access to technology and the ability to build opinions on a larger scale are removed from reality now?
While the people in small excluded communities know what's going on. Never heard that before. Oh well, it's the new way to fight for the right I suppose. You just turn everything 180°.

Posted by fidius on 2016-12-23 00:37:37

It's easy to say that when you misconstrue (misunderstand?) my argument. By "natural reality" I mean how things get made, what hard work feels like, depending on your neighbours instead of government, etc. If you honestly don't get how this might colour a person's political views then I rest my case. ;)

Posted by Wreckage on 2016-12-23 00:53:14

I think the choice of politicians should be based on the quality of their work and not based on what farm work feels like but ok.

Posted by licker on 2016-12-23 01:45:29

@fidius

Not at all. Trump himself is a racist, sexist, homophobic piece of garbage. I don't need any Dems to tell me that, it's completely self evident to anyone who pays attention to what the man says and does, and what he has said and done in his past.

I don't need to list the abominations he has surrounded himself with either to further that point do I? His chief of staff is a self admitted white supremacist, and he doesn't even try to hide that fact.

I don't think you're evil though if you voted Trump. I may think you're a moron though. What is fundamentally true, is that anyone who voted for Trump voted for a self admitted racist, sexist, and homophobe.

Hey if you're cool with that, be cool with it, just don't try to hide what you did or what it ultimately means. (not using you as you, fidius, since I don't know if you voted for him or not)

@wreckage

Yep. Too bad people in this country are too dumb and or lazy to bother learning what their politicians think or want to do. So we wound up with the most horrific choice possible. Trump, a complete disaster, vs. Clinton, a complete disaster (but in a different way). Then you had the idiots spewing about 'wasting your vote' if you didn't vote for one of them...

It's sad and pathetic that the vast majority of people in the US are so stupid.

Posted by happygrue on 2016-12-23 02:23:01

I spent many hours in the weeks after the election seeking out Trump supporters and talking about why they supported him. The basic response I got (and I talked to many smart, savvy, kind people) was that they just don't believe what he says. They interpret his crazy words and style in code. That means they (for the most part) don't believe he's going to build a wall, but it also means they don't believe he's as racist and misogynistic as his words seem to imply.

I think these people have a point - Trump is a clever guy and he has shown that he is not to be underestimated. But I also think they are fooling themselves when they think that good things are going to result from his election. Anyone who says "this country should be run more like a business" and is fine looking the other way on bigotry and oppression of opponents should go look up the definition of fascism and do some reading about the rise of the various other authoritarian strong-man governments of the past and current world. I'm not trying to imply we'll all end up in a world war but the point here is that bringing big business and big government together while silencing opposition is... a pretty textbook definition here. ;)

Posted by Ghoulguts on 2016-12-23 03:05:50

I'm wondering what this thread is even doing on a website dedicated to playing Blood Bowl to be honest.

Posted by PainState on 2016-12-23 03:41:52

Well I just found the map interesting. What these jack wads are talking about, well, let them talk it out.

Posted by Uedder on 2016-12-23 03:56:40

Well, as any of us knows to build a totalitarism you need complete control over the media. This means that nowadays the only way to build one is by controlling the internet, something that's not going to happen in western world - not by the government part anyway.

Even without putting the internet in the equation, it's been pretty clear how many 'traditional' media have been against trump and continue to do so in the future.

One thing is if a president/governor/whatever reacts with rage and insults - trump style - to the opposition. That's bad, unhealthy, ill-mannered and all, but gets nowhere near totalitarism/fascism.

If he, or she, puts them in jail - something a us president can't do - kills them or in whatever way forces them into silence, that's nearing totalitarism.

Besides, it would be really hard to enforce a totalitarism with an armed civil population.

So, there's no fascist threat in trump's election. You guys had Bush jr for 8 years and worry about trump? Seriously?

The truth is there's little a politician can do to change the way a country is run or its economy. Corporations rule on that. Obama was in charge 8 years, what could he really do? Is racism less of a problem? Is social/economic division narrowed? Is the environment safer?

Politicians are just there so we can blame them instead of the ones really making the calls. Look at what 1 bank collapsing did in 2008. Do you really think a politician can sit at the table with these economic/financial behemoths and pronounce the word 'no'?

Posted by licker on 2016-12-23 03:58:28

@grue

They have a point? The point is that they are willing to vote for someone whom they don't believe means what he is saying?

I refuse to accept that excuse from Trump supporters. If they just say they are fine with racism, ... then cool, they are fine with it. If they try to have it both ways? Nope, either they were not informed enough to make a reasoned decision, or they were informed and didn't care.

Again, that doesn't make them evil, it just makes them stupid and or lazy. Or in denial about what they actually did. Probably more the latter, I had a brief infatuation with Trump during the primaries, but more in the sense of this guy can't win, but he can shake things up.

Once it became apparent he was going to win the primaries I realized the error in my thinking him a harmless buffoon. I still have hope that the government generally is entrenched enough to resist the worst of what he might do, but then again that's sad since the government is so entrenched in the first place. Best case is that this is just a 4 year set back to getting anywhere, and once Trump is gone there will be a new willingness to do better.

Best case that is, not most likely case :(

Posted by Matthueycamo on 2016-12-23 13:20:17

In the game of who is worse at least trump will be great for satirical politics shows. Bush was great, Obama was rubbish, Trump has the potentual to be the best ever US president for entertainment! HIGNFY should try and get him to host it one episode!

Those maps are pretty funny though.


Funny maps